Heavy bags vs. Training dummies

[mike2011]

Just wondering about some thoughts on heavy bags vs. training dummies or the Century B.O.B's for home use. I'm sure both have their pros and cons. However, I;m trying to get enough facts to sway me one way or the other. I'd eventuallt like to have both. But right now, both budget and space are a little limited. I look foreward to your various opinions.

[Rob Broad]

Just wondering about some thoughts on heavy bags vs. training dummies or the Century B.O.B's for home use. I'm sure both have their pros and cons. However, I;m trying to get enough facts to sway me one way or the other. I'd eventuallt like to have both. But right now, both budget and space are a little limited. I look foreward to your various opinions.

Century's B.O.B is great. I had one and loved it. The Utraman dummy is also supposed to be very good.

[J-squared]

I think first you have to figure what your goals and objectives for the tool will be.

Are you wanting to do multiple timed rounds of high intensity (like boxers do)?
Do you want to work your footwork as well?
Do you want to practice striking specific regions?
Are you getting this tool to consistantly practice full power strikes?
Are you wanting to use it to improve conditioning?

For circuits, full power strikes and foot work the hanging heavy bag is probably the best choice. The bags on plastic bases offer the same advantages, just not so much on the footwork.

The Bob will definately work well for strike placement. Probably not as good for circuits.

[RamsHead]

Check out the bob xl as it has a groin. the nice bit about working a bob is you can really refine targeting and chokes as well as beat the unholly hell out of em.

[execkenpo]

I think first you have to figure what your goals and objectives for the tool will be.

Are you wanting to do multiple timed rounds of high intensity (like boxers do)?
Do you want to work your footwork as well?
Do you want to practice striking specific regions?
Are you getting this tool to consistantly practice full power strikes?
Are you wanting to use it to improve conditioning?

For circuits, full power strikes and foot work the hanging heavy bag is probably the best choice. The bags on plastic bases offer the same advantages, just not so much on the footwork.

The Bob will definately work well for strike placement. Probably not as good for circuits.

Pretty much all to consider is covered above except for maybe space limitations and cost. You really need a place to hang a bag. This is where a dummie can edge out the competition. When I used to be a renter, the heavy bag was not really a viable option so a dummie would have really been a great choice, except for cost. As a homeowner I am able to drill holes in floors joists, etc and don't have other tenants to worry about when the building shakes from my powerful kicks

I will say that considering myself 'old school' I still prefer the feel of hitting a leather heavy bag with bare fists/feet over any of the training dummies out there. The BOB's are definately a better choice over the foam covered water filled things. I do like the specific targets of a BOB, but visualization works just fine as far as I am concerned when using a heavy bag.

When talking about conditioning, I personally don't think anything will beat a heavy bag in this area (in this context....makiwara boards or iron palm bags are a different animal). I used to have a canvas heavy bag that no beginer would even consider as my training mate that I lost in a divorce

There really is a 'pure' feeling about hitting a heavy bag that I don't get from a BOB or other freestanding target.

[Texas Kenpo]

I have to agree with what has already been said here. Bob is nice for target specific training but there is nothing like a heavy bag for feeling resistance to your strikes. I personally would go with the heavy bag if I had to choose one. I don't have a bob but have had a wavemaster for a couple years and just got a heavy bag (100lb) for Christmas. The difference between striking the wave (which i find somewhat comparable to bob) vs the heavy is considerable. In fact I have not even used my wave since getting the heavy.

[jdinca]

Being a training dummy myself, I think it all depends on what you're trying to achieve.

[Shepherd]

I prefer BOB (with trunks, so groin/upper leg targets, also). Can still wail on it to an extent, but for presicion work can't be beat. JMHO.

[GSteinUSA]

If you have to choose one, definitely go for the traditional, hanging heavy bag assuming you have the facilities to hang it properly. You just can't beat a heavy bag for resistance to your strikes and helping with foot work. For targetting, you could allways place some markers on the bag to designate various body parts.

Additionally, having a BOB is really cool. Just from the point of view of having a realistic target to hit, at least for the first strike or two. You could also practice portions of techniques; but not whole techniques...

The problem with a BOB, other than lack of resistance like a heavy bag, is it won't react to strikes like a real human would react; e.g. if you hit him in the solar plexus, he's not going to bend over or buckle, so if you're practicing a technique that has follow up strikes to the head for example, it would not be in the correct position. The best way to really deal with this is to work with another person (not actually hitting that person though) that would properly simulate the body movement and correctly react to various strikes. You could practice this way in slow motion at first. That way as you work on a technique, you'll have a much more realistic example of body mechanics and movement, your positioning in relation to the target, timing, footwork and shifting target areas.

Ideally, you would combine these methods of training though...

[Martin Seck]

Heavy bag is fantastic for full contact ... however my prefered dummy is the Ultraman by Karate Connection. You can hit the groin, knees, hip joints and such you can not hit on a BOB.

www.karateconnection.com is where you can buy one. It will last you a lifetime, I love mine.

[bujuts]

An advantage of heavy bags is of course their design to take a lot of impact. The biggest problem I have with them is the way they move - they swing up, and don't allow for much in terms of continuous attack with stance work. I prefer to hang a heavy back on a ring or pulley suspended on a taught table. This allows for continuous attacks with your stances, not just stationary ones.

Cheers,

Steven Brown
UKF

[Kosho Gakkusei]

I just recently saw that they now make BOB that's designed to be hung like a heavy bag - could this be the best of both worlds?


_Don Flatt

[J-squared]

I just recently saw that they now make BOB that's designed to be hung like a heavy bag - could this be the best of both worlds?


_Don Flatt

I saw one at Dick's sporting goods. I just don't believe I would go round after round of full contact with it like one would a regular heavy bag. I don't think it would "feel" the same.

[execkenpo]

I just recently saw that they now make BOB that's designed to be hung like a heavy bag - could this be the best of both worlds?

_Don Flatt

I wonder if it can hang freely without the bottom tethers and the frame. It would be difficult to move around with all that hardware in the way. This brings to mind one of my biggest complaints with BOB specifically...the bolts on the back of the thing...it kind of hurts when you hit them.

Mark

[tiktok86]

Personally I think you would get the best all-around use out of a heavy bag, assuming you have the place to hang one. A heavy bag can be used to work so many different kinds of things in your training that I can't even imagine not using one. Whereas a BOB gives you the ability to replicate anatomical targets, as Stein pointed out they will not respond in the same way that you can expect a real person would. Also if you wanted to, simply mark your targets on the heavy bag using colored tape or something similar.

[Martin Seck]

http://www.karateconnection.com/Dumm...%20Nisberg.WMV

Can't break this dummy ...

[Carol]

They are good for different purposes. Heavy bags are better for developing power. They move more like a person would and they can be unforgiving if your technique isn't dead on.

The BOB is better for developing finess. You can target specific areas and perform some attacks (ie: chokes) in ways that you can't do with a heavy bag. It's also more forgiving (less risk of injury) for someone that is still building themselves up.

[kenpotex]

They are both good for certain things. However, I find that I spend most of my time on the heavy-bag as opposed to the BOB.

[John M. La Tourrette]

Just wondering about some thoughts on heavy bags vs. training dummies or the Century B.O.B's for home use. I'm sure both have their pros and cons. However, I’m trying to get enough facts to sway me one way or the other. I'd eventually like to have both. But right now, both budget and space are a little limited. I look forward to your various opinions.

Both Mike.

In fact we have heavy bag, Mak Chong, waves, speed bags, hanging belts, small hand held shield, big hand held shield, the POWER shield, the wall Makiwara, the hand held Makiwara, the concrete block, and human bodies.

All of the above tools have specific usages they are built to perform.

If money is the constraint, I’d suggest you go with a heavy bag, and just adjust your contact for power, versus speed, versus penetration.

I suggest you NEVER train with “air” shots, and always have some type of real target, even if it is only a hanging belt, or a hanging towel.

You can find them cheap at flea markets for between $10-$20 bucks.

Wrist toughening is easy with knuckle pushups done on concrete with the Ram’s head.

Then you need to hit something so you can “feel” the distance and the target penetration.

Sincerely,
©Dr. John M. La Tourrette

[Brother John]

Just wondering about some thoughts on heavy bags vs. training dummies or the Century B.O.B's for home use. I'm sure both have their pros and cons. However, I;m trying to get enough facts to sway me one way or the other. I'd eventuallt like to have both. But right now, both budget and space are a little limited. I look foreward to your various opinions.

If budget and space are limited, I'd highly recomend that you first go with a heavy bag! They're very versatile and there's LOTS of good work do be done with them! In fact, I see bag work as very crucial. IF you can, eventually save up a few more $$$ and shell out for a water core punching bag. VERY worth the resources!!

Training dummies are okay. Their use is more task specific. They're best if you have someone teaching you HOW to use it to the best advantage, I think.

The BOB's are great! But again, I'd recomend you save up some money and splurge for the hanging ones. I'll NEVER again buy one of those 'free-standing' units!!!!!! WORTHLESS. Those ones that you fill with water or sand and then they are SUPPOSED to remain upright while you punch them.
TRUST ME...any power in what you're doing and they fall over or scoot to another place...at best. And why try on such a device if you're not going to use power? Not worth your time and resources.

Also: If you have a training partner or two that you can get together with on a regular or semi-regular basis, I highly recomend you purchase two "focus mitts". They are GREAT., and they don't cost much of anything. IF you get creative with them, theres a LOT, I mean a LOT you can do.

Good hunting and enjoy the workouts.
Your Brother
John