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Thread: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

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    Kempo91 is offline
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    Default Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    My training in Kempo was to examine everything and find what works best. Our teacher had no problems showing us how to do something from Jujitsu if he thought it would make us better at self defense.

    In that spirit, I wonder why people have the need to say all martial arts are equal, that all martial arts work on the street, and other statements like those.

    I believe some martial arts are for sports and not self defense. I believe other martial arts are for self defense and fighting. For example, I believe someone who knows Kempo will not get their butts kicked in a street fight. I also believe that some martial arts like Judo are not made for street fighting. I am 100% certain that someone will read that last sentance and think I am bashing Judo, but I am not. I think Judo is a fine sport. I believe that they are two different martial arts with two different purposes.

    I wonder how others here would rank various martial arts in terms of which ones are more sporting and which are more for street fighting.

    I said in a previous post I thought aikido was more sport than fighting. I talked with a friend who knows a lot of aikido, and his response to me was (biased because he loves aikido), he said "for someone who studies Kempo or Taekwondo for one year, that person might be better able to win a street fight than someone who studies Aikido. But after 5 years of study, the person who knows Aikido will be better able to fight than someone from Kempo". He thinks there is a harder learning curve for Aikido and that is what makes it appear to be less effective for self defense. I think he is wrong, but that is my opinion.

    What opinions do people have for other martial arts. If you wanted to be the best street fighter, how would you become that? What martial arts would you train hard in, and which ones would you discount? Lets throw all the PC jargon out the window and have a truthfull conversation about the various schools of martial arts.

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Train whatever style or system suits your personality and desires. None of them are bullet-proof, if that is what you are still after.

    Martial sport is easily adapted to fighting, so training in a sport art is not necessarily wasted for self defense. Training AS a self defense art is obviously better for self defense. So Kenpo trained for sport would not necessarily be as good as Judo trained for self defense. And some schools do train Kenpo just for sport.

    If you read the history of Judo, it gained its' fame by defeating all the Jiu-Jitsu schools at the time of its inception. A lot of CQC systems are still based in large part on Judo techniques. So don't discount its effectiveness in combat.

    Aikido is an internal art. There is a greater learning curve for internal arts. But, trained diligently as combat arts, their effecacy is amazing.

    Last, you are still looking for the ultimate, unbeatable, kick butt art on the planet. OK, I'll tell you. You won't like it, but, seriously, here it is.

    Tai Chi.

    Dan C

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    John M. La Tourrette (03-26-2007)

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Kempo91 wrote, "I wonder why people have the need to say all martial arts are equal, that all martial arts work on the street, and other statements like those." People make these statements in response to idiotic broad statements about various arts.

    I have said in another thread and I will say it again. Go to a class and then ask questions.

    All these statements you are currently making about artsfeels like trolling to me.
    Quality outweighs quantity every time.

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by thedan View Post
    If you read the history of Judo, it gained its' fame by defeating all the Jiu-Jitsu schools at the time of its inception. A lot of CQC systems are still based in large part on Judo techniques. So don't discount its effectiveness
    I thought Judo was the sporting version of Jujitsu with all the more dangerous parts removed? I know Jujitsu is what the Japanese army is trained in.

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Broad View Post
    Kempo91 wrote, "I wonder why people have the need to say all martial arts are equal, that all martial arts work on the street, and other statements like those." People make these statements in response to idiotic broad statements about various arts.

    I have said in another thread and I will say it again. Go to a class and then ask questions.

    All these statements you are currently making about artsfeels like trolling to me.
    What you are saying is like if this place was a football forum and I asked "What is better for winning a game, passing or running the ball?". And then you said "That's like trolling".

    How is it trolling to ask how the different martial arts rank against each other, and which are best for street fighting?

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    I'm leaving this forum. I ask an honest question and one of the moderators attacks me for no reason.

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    My question is why does this matter? Judo is Judo because it's not American Kenpo or Taekwondo and so on.

    Each art is unique and each art is exactly the same. Arts are unique in their nuances and tactics. However they are exactly the same when examined on the individual level. They are exactly the same in that every individual person who practices an art gets something totally unique out of it.


    So I ask you what is best? Is it the same as my best or my neighbor's best? It's arbitrary and totally meaningless on a scale larger than your own interpretation.
    Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kempo91 View Post
    I'm leaving this forum. I ask an honest question and one of the moderators attacks me for no reason.
    He's not bashing you. He's just calling it like he sees it. That's why we're here. To debate, share ideas, and learn. Sometimes you need to have thick skin not only on the mat and in the street, but on messageboards. Kenpoists have a plethora of viewpoints-and we don't always agree on things. But don't take it personally. If you do, you may miss out on something.
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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kempo91 View Post
    I'm leaving this forum. I ask an honest question and one of the moderators attacks me for no reason.
    You claimed to have studied in your teens which was over 15 yrs ago, but you post like a teenager. You make broad statements that are derogatory to other martial artists, to me that sounds like trolling. You comment on things that you have little or no knowledge of and you are not even training or studying anywhere, to me that is just huberous.

    You have whined about the privacy policy on this site in more than one thread, and in almost every thread you have started you have made comments that show ignorance of the arts represented on this board. I really do suggest you go find a school and do some trainng before you start making such broad statements about the martial arts.
    Quality outweighs quantity every time.

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    No one is bashing here other then yourself. You continue to make assumptions of other arts. When I came to Kenpo, I had 26 years of previous martial arts training. There were no lay overs and no down times in my training. I studied continuously and at times in two arts at the same time. I never looked at arts and said well that is a "sport". Wrestling is a "sport" but yet it transfers to MMA and to street fighting.
    I had reservations about Kenpo, but never said well it's just a slap art and has zero transfer to the real world. I decided to seek out and learn which I did not know to then make an educated decision as to what I thought of the art. They all have purpose and merit. You should simply learn that in underestimating arts, people. Etc. you have lost site of that you should never underestimate anything. That is a cardinal mistake that a trained fighter would make you pay dearly for.
    For the record, Aikido is an internal art and yes the curve is greater. I have found that mixing it with some Kenpo techniques to be incredibly more powerful then I saw with an eye only for Aikido. Yet alone, in a well trained persons mind, it will stand just fine by itself. Many thanks to The DAN for your coments.
    "Fear is the true opiate of combat."

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by ronin6 View Post
    Many thanks to The DAN for your coments.
    Not a problem, sir. I think we are all telling him the same thing.

    You can lead a horse to water, but sometimes it's best just to drown the son of a gun.

    Dan C

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by thedan View Post
    You can lead a horse to water, but sometimes it's best just to drown the son of a gun.

    Dan C
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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kempo91 View Post
    For example, I believe someone who knows Kempo will not get their butts kicked in a street fight. I also believe that some martial arts like Judo are not made for street fighting. I am 100% certain that someone will read that last sentance and think I am bashing Judo, but I am not. I think Judo is a fine sport. I believe that they are two different martial arts with two different purposes.
    I know of several judo practitioners that could change your mind.
    I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me.
    (Phillipians 4:13)


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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Seabrook View Post
    I know of several judo practitioners that could change your mind.
    You and me both!

    Kempo91, what exactly is your interest here? Do you want to start training again? If not, and you do not currently practice martial arts...why are you here? You would be just as apt to go post on a Home & Garden forum... that is assuming you're not in to planting flowers and such. Are you thinking of starting your training again and just want advice on what type of school to join?
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." Charles A. Beard

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    People often seem to forget that the woman/man makes the art, and not vice versa.

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    I visit a lot of school outside Kenpo. Mostly hard styles. They are great at kicking,punching ,and Kata. They simply don't have effective self defense techniques. I am not saying all of them are that way but if their self defense is good they have probably gone outside their systems to learn it. I have attended many of their Black Balt tests and they were hard put to come up with possibly 10 self defence techniques. That is all they required to pass.

    A very good friend of mine is an 8th Degree in a Okinawan hard style that is very popular. He has studied with us for 15 years to learn practical self defense. He is very god at it now and is incorporating it into his system.

    I am Most Repectfully,
    Sifuroy

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    Default Re: Politically Correct in Martial Arts?

    >Train whatever style or system suits your personality and desires. None of >them are bullet-proof, if that is what you are still after.

    Yep.

    Many have an ego that states, “Because I do Kenpo Karate I'm 10 feet tall and bullet proof”, or “I do Taekwon-do and I’m bullet proof”.

    And no one is bullet proof.

    I agree that humility is very important, but NOT the fake humility.

    Which is the reason that the Kenpo Karate person is taught on his first lesson, Hiken, "I conceal my treasure", which is the knowledge that you have of Kenpo Karate warrior skills.

    Therefore even if the other guy is bigger, stronger, faster, and smarter, he will never see you coming.

    Just a thought.

    ©Dr. John M. La Tourrette

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