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    Default Royce Gracie

    I just wanted to take the time to say that Royce Gracie (and his family for that matter) is truly the REAL DEAL.

    In the early 1990s when Royce Gracie dominated the Octagon, almost everyone wanted some part of Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. Everything was Gracie this, or Gracie that. Yes, we often had some Kenpoists talk about how they could beat him in a fight, even though nobody dared get in the ring with him (with the exception of Keith Hackney who is not an American Kenpoist).

    Since Gracie's first round loss to Matt Hughes, suddenly the BJJ aura seems to be diminishing. So many people (Kenpoists are extremely bad for this) have so much to say about Royce, and how the Gracie art "hasn't kept up with the times". But unlike so many of these keyboard Kenpoists, Royce Gracie puts his reputation and family art on the line OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

    It is no surprise that Royce has BJJ schools all across the globe. Stop and think about that for a minute. Could you imagine if you had Kenpo schools under your banner scattered across the world? Would you put your reputation on the line against one of the toughest and most feared guys on the earth? Gracie did. And I am willing to bet, he will do it again.

    Royce Gracie exemplifies character, perseverance, and integrity, as does the rest of his family. Gracie Jiu-Jitsu has "kept up with the times". Royce did not have a good fight....but doesn't that happen to all great champions at one time or another?

    The true champion is one that takes defeat, but then gets back up. I love Proverbs 24:16, "Failure isn't falling down. It's staying down".
    Last edited by Seabrook; 06-18-2006 at 03:22 PM.
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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    great post Mr. Seabtrook.. i do agree.. and i thought that same thing (not as many words ) about royce when he said that he would fight huges.. I think that Royce is a true champion, in victory and defeat... I have nothing but respect for the man for what he has done in the octigon and for the martial arts..

    i think we will see him again, and i think that we will see a better prepaired Royce Gracie..
    "The sacraed rights of mankind are not to be rummaged for among old parchments or musty records. They are written, as with a sunbeam, in the whole volume of human nature, by the hand of the divinity itself, and can never be erased.""

    Alexander Hamilton
    The Farmer Refuted (1775)

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Great post. I totally agree. Royce will always be a champion and his family has done much to promote the growth of the martial arts.

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Please forgive me in advance for saying this, but I don't think he lost that fight, I think he gave it away. Watch it again closely, I think you'll agree that he could have done better.

    I don't think the gracie hype will ever die. this fight just caused more people to talk about him.

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    I still have respect for him. Now I'm going out to start a fight so that I can avoid the Kenpo Keyboardist label, LOL!

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Quote Originally Posted by lenatoi
    Please forgive me in advance for saying this, but I don't think he lost that fight, I think he gave it away.
    What do you mean by "gave it away"?
    I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me.
    (Phillipians 4:13)


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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    The Gracie's and BJJ have contributed greatly to the world of Martial Arts.
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." Charles A. Beard

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Mr. Gracie is a True Champion and will always have my respect! Besides all the MMA guys nowadays use jujitsu or another form of grappling in their training. All because of the Gracie dominance early on.

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Hi Mr. Jamie,

    Got a question. When you say
    I just wanted to take the time to say that Royce Gracie (and his family for that matter) is truly the REAL DEAL.
    What exactly do you mean by that? In martial arts in general, or in competitions like UFC/Pride?

    And let me ask you this, do you believe most of Royce's opponents were actually good? Why do you think he has so many wins?

    Warren

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Seabrook, I completely agree with you. The Gracie family has had a tremendous impact on contemporary martial arts, and I believe will continue to do so.
    All difficult things have their origin in that which is easy, and great things in that which is small. - Lao Tzu


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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Quote Originally Posted by crane557 View Post
    Mr. Gracie is a True Champion and will always have my respect! Besides all the MMA guys nowadays use jujitsu or another form of grappling in their training. All because of the Gracie dominance early on.
    This is exactly correct. Hughes or anybody else can say what they like about Gracie not winning this fight, but the fact is if it wasnt for Royce Gracie, Matt Hughes wouldn't even know he needed a ground game. If it hadn't been for Royce's domination early on in the UFC, most of these fighters would just go on believing their art or system was better. It was because of Royce Gracie and hisfamily that Mixed Martial Arts became "Mixed" Martial Arts. I truley believe we are living in the time of a legend. Royce Gracie and his family have brought to the martial arts as much as any well known or famous martial artist in the past.

    As far as Gracie losing the fight, well the fight depends more on the fighter than the system they are using. If u take two people and teach them the same system, one of them learns the system, the other learns the system and works their cardio and diet and all aspects of being a sports men, who do u think will come out on top in a "sporting event"?
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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Quote Originally Posted by Warren044 View Post
    And let me ask you this, do you believe most of Royce's opponents were actually good? Why do you think he has so many wins?

    Warren

    I beleive Royce Gracie has so many wins because he knew something his opponent did not know. Whether it be in a BJJ tournament, the UFC, or wherever. At the time, he had a little more technique than they did. It is a little different now because of his fights such as in the UFC. The UFC brought world-wide recogniction to his system, as a result more people now know what he knew due to them seeking out his system.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]SALUTE!

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Quote Originally Posted by Warren044 View Post
    Hi Mr. Jamie,

    Got a question. When you say

    What exactly do you mean by that? In martial arts in general, or in competitions like UFC/Pride?

    And let me ask you this, do you believe most of Royce's opponents were actually good? Why do you think he has so many wins?

    Warren
    Royce is the REAL DEAL in both martial arts generally and in competitions.

    About Royce's opponents - some were not as good as others, while some were tough as nails. I wouldn't have wanted to fight guys like Dan "The Beast" Severn (whom I have had the opportunity of training with once before), Ken Shamrock of 13 years ago, not to mention Matt Hughes despite his loss.

    Royce is also a class act.
    I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me.
    (Phillipians 4:13)


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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Quote Originally Posted by Seabrook View Post
    Royce is the REAL DEAL in both martial arts generally and in competitions.

    About Royce's opponents - some were not as good as others, while some were tough as nails. I wouldn't have wanted to fight guys like Dan "The Beast" Severn (whom I have had the opportunity of training with once before), Ken Shamrock of 13 years ago, not to mention Matt Hughes despite his loss.

    Royce is also a class act.
    You left out Kimo. That's one tough hombre! He beat Gracie so bad he couldn't continue...but let's not forget that even though he took one heck of a physical beat down, in the end he still made Kimo tap.
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." Charles A. Beard

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    It's cowardly to question Royce's skill by questioning his ring opponents. I was -- I kid you not -- the first big, dumb kenpo black belt to sign up with the Gracies in Torrance. At that time, there had been no UFC yet, and the matches were in the studio ala the "Gracie Challenge".

    In the old challenge match days, there were no weight divisions, rules, hype campaigns, etc. Guys came in off the street every night and every Saturday morning to try and earn 100K by beating a Gracie. In the period just prior to the UFC, the other brothers had split to open their own studios (Rickson to Santa Monica, Royler back down to Rio, Relson to Hawaii), and Rorion had pretty much retired from grueling rigor to be the business man of the family. That left one guy for all the walk-ins: Royce. He fought more bare-knuckle in-house matches in the coupla years prior to the UFC than did most bare-knuckle prize fighters in their careers.

    He couldn't punch to save his life: We always teased him about hitting like a girl (but you didn't tease too insistently, or he'd get you when training started). His strategy and technique were flawless. And if you happened not to be there when a match happened, that was OK...they taped them. Rorion's office had a bookshelf full of videotapes, dozens of fights per tape, dozens of tapes per shelf. All you had to do was ask courteously: "Rorion...when you get a moment, can we see the one with the two super-heavy wrestlers from Philadelphia?" (one of the last challenge matches before the UFC, Royce went to Philly to take on two guys much bigger than he...one just under 400 lbs, and one just over...he beat them, of course. They were too stubborn to tap, so one got a bad back from it, and the other a sprained -- maybe broken -- wrist)

    I had the pleasure of rolling with Royce at the Academy every Tuesday and Thursday night, and Saturday afternoons. We had the sense back then that we were rolling with a celebrity and legend, but not because of the UFC (it didn't exist yet). The reason we felt honored to be in his class was because we had all seen him take any and all comers for a couple of years, beat them, take his licks as he got them, and still show up for work the next day.

    And this ain't counting the number of surf rats, partiers, punkers, etc., who were sure they could take that skinny Brazilian dude with the funny accent.

    Royce is the real deal. And a kind man to boot. Hell, he put up with my wierd sense of humer for a spell.

    Best Regards,

    Dave
    Clear mind, clear movement. Mastery of the Arts is mastery over the Self. That in this moment, this motion, the thoughts, memories, impulses and passions that cloud the mind must yield to the clarity of purpose, and purity of motion.

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    We'll I know some Gracies are a bit over confident nowadays.. considering in my opinion of the fighters they all fought in the past they considered they thought couldn't get anyone any better.

    I'm not sure what year this was, of Ralph Gracie.. but watch what he does.. it is pretty damn ignorant, hell, I still laugh to this day what the outcome of this fight came to.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zchT1UlINWQ
    All it takes is one good shot folks and this wasn't even that quick..

    Oh, and this guy Kazushi Sakurbaba supposively beat all of the Gracies, in which some showed respect, I think Royce did, but not sure about his bros

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CERNSyu2q3c

    Yet this man, knowing how big of an acheivement this was, showed respect for all of them.

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Yoshida supposively won a fight against Royce:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vId1v6N0SEU

    And here is the outcome after:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQeCJg0c91s

    Even though "Royce" did not tap out, the REF was on nobodys side, and the REF stopped the fight due to the regulations of someone not being able to breathe for a long period of time, shutting eyes, which could result in bad terms.

    This kinda of stuff I just cant stand at all, not being able to accept a lose.
    My point is, I do believe Royce is a good competitor, just from looking at ring fights, he has my respect in his MMA record, but I do believe the Gracies are disrespectful also.
    Last edited by Warren044; 01-09-2007 at 01:33 PM.

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Dave in da house View Post
    It's cowardly to question Royce's skill by questioning his ring opponents. I was -- I kid you not -- the first big, dumb kenpo black belt to sign up with the Gracies in Torrance. At that time, there had been no UFC yet, and the matches were in the studio ala the "Gracie Challenge".

    In the old challenge match days, there were no weight divisions, rules, hype campaigns, etc. Guys came in off the street every night and every Saturday morning to try and earn 100K by beating a Gracie. In the period just prior to the UFC, the other brothers had split to open their own studios (Rickson to Santa Monica, Royler back down to Rio, Relson to Hawaii), and Rorion had pretty much retired from grueling rigor to be the business man of the family. That left one guy for all the walk-ins: Royce. He fought more bare-knuckle in-house matches in the coupla years prior to the UFC than did most bare-knuckle prize fighters in their careers.

    He couldn't punch to save his life: We always teased him about hitting like a girl (but you didn't tease too insistently, or he'd get you when training started). His strategy and technique were flawless. And if you happened not to be there when a match happened, that was OK...they taped them. Rorion's office had a bookshelf full of videotapes, dozens of fights per tape, dozens of tapes per shelf. All you had to do was ask courteously: "Rorion...when you get a moment, can we see the one with the two super-heavy wrestlers from Philadelphia?" (one of the last challenge matches before the UFC, Royce went to Philly to take on two guys much bigger than he...one just under 400 lbs, and one just over...he beat them, of course. They were too stubborn to tap, so one got a bad back from it, and the other a sprained -- maybe broken -- wrist)

    I had the pleasure of rolling with Royce at the Academy every Tuesday and Thursday night, and Saturday afternoons. We had the sense back then that we were rolling with a celebrity and legend, but not because of the UFC (it didn't exist yet). The reason we felt honored to be in his class was because we had all seen him take any and all comers for a couple of years, beat them, take his licks as he got them, and still show up for work the next day.

    And this ain't counting the number of surf rats, partiers, punkers, etc., who were sure they could take that skinny Brazilian dude with the funny accent.

    Royce is the real deal. And a kind man to boot. Hell, he put up with my wierd sense of humer for a spell.

    Best Regards,

    Dave
    Great story,

    thanks

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Takanori Gomi beat him with a simple sprawl technique. That clip did prove, contrary to what a lot of grapplers say, that a knee to the face during a shoot attempt can be quite effective.
    Those clips don't really take anything away from the Gracies though, they have many more "wins" than they do losses. Anybody can loose a fight on any given day regardless of one's training. I know I wouldn't turn down an opportunity to train with any of them.
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." Charles A. Beard

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    Default Re: Royce Gracie

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Dave in da house View Post
    It's cowardly to question Royce's skill by questioning his ring opponents. I was -- I kid you not -- the first big, dumb kenpo black belt to sign up with the Gracies in Torrance. At that time, there had been no UFC yet, and the matches were in the studio ala the "Gracie Challenge".

    In the old challenge match days, there were no weight divisions, rules, hype campaigns, etc. Guys came in off the street every night and every Saturday morning to try and earn 100K by beating a Gracie. In the period just prior to the UFC, the other brothers had split to open their own studios (Rickson to Santa Monica, Royler back down to Rio, Relson to Hawaii), and Rorion had pretty much retired from grueling rigor to be the business man of the family. That left one guy for all the walk-ins: Royce. He fought more bare-knuckle in-house matches in the coupla years prior to the UFC than did most bare-knuckle prize fighters in their careers.

    He couldn't punch to save his life: We always teased him about hitting like a girl (but you didn't tease too insistently, or he'd get you when training started). His strategy and technique were flawless. And if you happened not to be there when a match happened, that was OK...they taped them. Rorion's office had a bookshelf full of videotapes, dozens of fights per tape, dozens of tapes per shelf. All you had to do was ask courteously: "Rorion...when you get a moment, can we see the one with the two super-heavy wrestlers from Philadelphia?" (one of the last challenge matches before the UFC, Royce went to Philly to take on two guys much bigger than he...one just under 400 lbs, and one just over...he beat them, of course. They were too stubborn to tap, so one got a bad back from it, and the other a sprained -- maybe broken -- wrist)

    I had the pleasure of rolling with Royce at the Academy every Tuesday and Thursday night, and Saturday afternoons. We had the sense back then that we were rolling with a celebrity and legend, but not because of the UFC (it didn't exist yet). The reason we felt honored to be in his class was because we had all seen him take any and all comers for a couple of years, beat them, take his licks as he got them, and still show up for work the next day.

    And this ain't counting the number of surf rats, partiers, punkers, etc., who were sure they could take that skinny Brazilian dude with the funny accent.

    Royce is the real deal. And a kind man to boot. Hell, he put up with my wierd sense of humer for a spell.

    Best Regards,

    Dave
    Thanks very much for sharing all of that Dave.

    I consider yourself a privileged man to have trained with them and to know them personally.
    I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me.
    (Phillipians 4:13)


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