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Thread: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

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    shaolinmonkmark is offline
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    Thumbs up has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    All the time, mostly by accident :/

    Or I watch old videos of Taiko Oyata and then pretend I made it up when I get to the school LOL
    -David C
    http://www.kungfubooksonline.com

    "...while you guys are arguing, I'm on the grind."
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    "If you don't ask the right questions, I can't give you the answers, and if you don't know the right question to ask, you're not ready for the answers"
    -Ed Parker Sr.

    "For many a 'system' is just a bunch of techniques. It should be much, much more than that..."
    - Doc Chapel

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Do you mean your own style of Kempo? Or are these forms/techniques?

    I always find it interesting when training with a partner and think you "created something new" and then discover that it's found later in a kata etc.
    "For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer."

    Romans 13:4

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    many Shaolin Kempo schools use the term "a kempo" to refer to a combination or technique they teach that is not part of the graded curricuulum. "Extras" What might be a "kempo" at one school might be required for rank at another.

    So, he's asking if anyone creates their own techniques.
    -David C
    http://www.kungfubooksonline.com

    "...while you guys are arguing, I'm on the grind."
    - an anonymous brick puncher

    "If you don't ask the right questions, I can't give you the answers, and if you don't know the right question to ask, you're not ready for the answers"
    -Ed Parker Sr.

    "For many a 'system' is just a bunch of techniques. It should be much, much more than that..."
    - Doc Chapel

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    Paulee is offline
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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    All the time, but only on accident. I'll be given the name of a technique, and then perform it, only to be met by quizical looks. "Can you do that again? What was that?"

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    All the time! Unfortunately, it's rarely intentional. Really seems to annoy my teacher...
    Be careful what you say, some may take it the wrong way.

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Most definately....the ones that I (and most often times others) feel are really effective and/or really demonstrate a particular principle I will write a technical breakdown for....just to have.

    If you think about it, there's an infinite number of combinations of basics to any any given scenario of attacks...so you could "create" an infinite number of "kempos".... ..if you wanted
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." – Charles A. Beard

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Mr. Crippler, with all due respect, I have thanked you. Reason being is that indeed, there are infinite responses ranging from totally ineffective to extremely effective and all variants in between.

    Folks have to remember that, no matter the school of Kenpo, the techniques are to learn from and reflect on. The whole idea has always been to point a way, in my opinion, not point "the" way.

    If someone is attacked with any given attack, and they respond successfully, do they cry, wail, and gnash their teeth if it isn't their school's particular answer to said attack? Or are they more or less happy that they are the one going home again? I think I'd be happy just to be going home, myself.

    Interestingly, for the bright and enterprising martial artist, you could sit down and perhaps using Tracy Karaté or American Kenpo, or Shaolin Kenpo, or what-have-you, as a model, create a whole system, yet again. It would not be Kenpo as the above mentioned schools of thought know it, but it would still, inevitibly be Kenpo, methinks.

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Sure they have:

    1. Master Mattera

    I do not remember who asked me but someone asked me which #'s of Kempo techniques were taught by Professor Chow. Well, none...They were invented by Villari, Mattera, etc.

    Not saying they are bad, but they did not come from Kara-Ho Kempo or Professor Chow.
    The above is just my opinion.

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Ok, now that I know what is meant, I can give an answer! :-) LOL

    I was reflecting on this yesterday even. The founders of a style (proven through fighting, not just a theory style) could always have the techniques worked because they were the ones that first USED those techniques that they put in there. They are not learning HOW to move a certain way, or WHY we do something. They do it, because it is their own personal approach.

    So based on that, I would say that you SHOULD create your own techniques based on your personal experience and approach. I think that to do otherwise you are always only going to be copying instead of truly making it your own. Then you need to try those things out with a resisting opponent to see if it works. You also need to try it against MANY different types of opponents. It might work against a certain skill level or type of fighter, but not be the best approach against someone else. It doesn't mean that it is not useful or useless, you just need to define the parameters of application for it.

    I think that the "preset" techniques we learn are ideas (in part) to get us to think of how we would approach that same situation. But, also it saves us some time because we dont have to start from scratch. Alot of the work has been done for us so we can stand on the research of previous masters and get to the destination a little quicker.
    "For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer."

    Romans 13:4

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    It's easy to make up some series of actions and supposed reactions. But to develop a technique that incorporates knowledge and lessons that are valuable within a broader body of knowledge, and that follow a deeper strategy, is far more difficult.

    However the process of exploring your own ideas for techniques is not only very fun but, IMHO, is also important to learning how your body parts work together.

    For example, I once asked Doc Chapel to teach me about the use of certain categories of self defense application (I was of course looking for some kind of shortcut where none exists) and the answer was "...observe the modalities of the techniques, it's all in there..." which really expanded my ideas about a number of things beyond the topic I had at hand (he's good at that).
    -David C
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    "...while you guys are arguing, I'm on the grind."
    - an anonymous brick puncher

    "If you don't ask the right questions, I can't give you the answers, and if you don't know the right question to ask, you're not ready for the answers"
    -Ed Parker Sr.

    "For many a 'system' is just a bunch of techniques. It should be much, much more than that..."
    - Doc Chapel

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Quote Originally Posted by shaolinmonkmark View Post
    has anyone created their own "Kempos"??
    Yep.

    In fact it's part of my rank requirements for my black belts at all levels.

    The master keys must be valid.

    The waza's must be very workable.

    They must be able to do them at will and demonstrate them on real bodies during their testing.

    They must be able to "talk" the master keys.

    They must be able to "write out" the master keys, and present them to the board.

    They must be able to "walk the talk" on the master keys.

    It's a great method of them "lengthening their line" instead of continuing to be someone's disciple.

    Dr. John M. La Tourrette

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    It is also part of our black belt requirement. I think most time people do make up their own technique whether it is intentional or not and some times we can make it look real good lol

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    Kempojujutsu is offline
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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Making sure the technique is workable is the major key. Anyone can make up a technique. But is it going to be effective when using it. Keep the technique simple and effective is my key.

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Quote Originally Posted by shaolinmonkmark View Post
    has anyone created their own "Kempos"??
    Yes.

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Quote Originally Posted by nelson View Post
    Dear Kenpo brothers and sisters,

    The answer of course is "Yes". People can and do create their own "flavors" of Kenpo. Are they all as effective as their "parent" art?
    Perhaps not. Some might be more effective as the art of American style Kenpo has evolved since it was first introduced by SGM Ed Parker.

    The style of Kenpo I learned was called "Bujin" named by my late instructor Michael Sanders. Mike learned his original Parker Kenpo from Mills Crenshaw and incorporated techniques from other MA styles when he developed his own version of the art.

    The proff of the puddin is in the tasting as they say. If it tastes bad it's "bad kenpo."

    Nelson Kari
    Nelson, I beleive the OP is not asking about styles of kempo, he is asking aoubt combinations or techniques. In many Shaolin kempo schools, "a kempo" is a technique that is taught but may not be part of the official material and usually not required for promotion.
    -David C
    http://www.kungfubooksonline.com

    "...while you guys are arguing, I'm on the grind."
    - an anonymous brick puncher

    "If you don't ask the right questions, I can't give you the answers, and if you don't know the right question to ask, you're not ready for the answers"
    -Ed Parker Sr.

    "For many a 'system' is just a bunch of techniques. It should be much, much more than that..."
    - Doc Chapel

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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Quote Originally Posted by nelson View Post
    Dear Kenpo brothers and sisters,

    The answer of course is "Yes". People can and do create their own "flavors" of Kenpo. Are they all as effective as their "parent" art?
    Perhaps not. Some might be more effective as the art of American style Kenpo has evolved since it was first introduced by SGM Ed Parker.

    The style of Kenpo I learned was called "Bujin" named by my late instructor Michael Sanders. Mike learned his original Parker Kenpo from Mills Crenshaw and incorporated techniques from other MA styles when he developed his own version of the art.

    The proff of the puddin is in the tasting as they say. If it tastes bad it's "bad kenpo."

    Nelson Kari
    I learned Parker and Tracy up to Black. But I put together a varient of Parker Kenpo and taught it for 15 years. Mind was good, but it didn't seem to draw the people like Parker Kenpo. Anyway, i figured out how to teach Parker Kenpo and Aikikenjitus. All empty hand techniques are Parker Kenpo, and all weapons and ground are Aikikenjitsu. In this way I'm blending the old with the new. It seems to be working. My student like the pure Kenpo.

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    Shaolindelt is offline
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    Default Re: has anyone created their own "Kempos"??

    Quote Originally Posted by aikikenjitsu View Post
    I learned Parker and Tracy up to Black. But I put together a varient of Parker Kenpo and taught it for 15 years. Mind was good, but it didn't seem to draw the people like Parker Kenpo. Anyway, i figured out how to teach Parker Kenpo and Aikikenjitus. All empty hand techniques are Parker Kenpo, and all weapons and ground are Aikikenjitsu. In this way I'm blending the old with the new. It seems to be working. My student like the pure Kenpo.
    I've kind of debated on keeping the Shaolin Kempo and the American Kenpo in my training separate, and being able to teach them independently. On the flip side, it is interesting combining them, and also reorganizing the whole thing based on the principles learned in each and working from there. When one takes the idea that EPAK is a way of thought and can be applied to other systems, it presents a whole range of new opportunities.

    In any case, right now most of my "students" aren't my students at all, but rather other high ranking Kempo guys that I'm sharing my thoughts with in refining the things we've learned over the last 20+ years. If I ever get back to teaching white belts, not sure what I'll be showing them . . .

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