Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 38

Thread: Extensions required for promotion?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    London, ON
    Posts
    1,601
    Thanks
    64
    Thanked 209 Times in 134 Posts

    Default Extensions required for promotion?

    Question:

    Does your school require all of the extensions of base techniques for promotion? If yes, which curriculum are you using (16, 24, 32, other)?


    Jamie Seabrook

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Baltimore, Maryland
    Posts
    2,270
    Thanks
    237
    Thanked 113 Times in 95 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Seabrook
    Question:

    Does your school require all of the extensions of base techniques for promotion? If yes, which curriculum are you using (16, 24, 32, other)?


    Jamie Seabrook
    Yes, right now I want to say 32. By the time I get back home it could be changed again.
    "To hear is to doubt. To see is to be deceived. But to feel is to believe." -- SGM Ed Parker

    "Sic vis pacem parabellum - If you want peace, prepare for war." -- "The Punisher"


    "Praying Mantis, very good. . . For catching bugs." --Jackie Chan

    "A horse stance is great for taking a dump" --Jet Li

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    London, ON
    Posts
    1,601
    Thanks
    64
    Thanked 209 Times in 134 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Still waiting for more replies here...

    Also, I'm positive that Mr. Palanzo doesn't teach the 32 system....


    Jamie Seabrook

  4. #4
    jfarnsworth's Avatar
    jfarnsworth is online now Parker / Planas Lineage
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Mansfield, Ohio
    Posts
    1,575
    Thanks
    157
    Thanked 386 Times in 260 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    I was only required the orange. I really wished that more were required. We could all go back and forth all day and discuss the pros. and cons. of why and why not to teach the extensions. Don't get me wrong I do have handfuls of the other colored belts just not set in stone as a requirement.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    London, ON
    Posts
    1,601
    Thanks
    64
    Thanked 209 Times in 134 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by jfarnsworth
    We could all go back and forth all day and discuss the pros. and cons. of why and why not to teach the extensions.
    But if we teach American Kenpo, and Ed Parker required the extensions as outlined in Infinite Insights, vol. 5, why wouldn't one teach the extensions? Far be it from us to say we know more than Ed Parker about what we should and should not be teaching.


    Jamie Seabrook

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Sarnia, ON, Canada
    Posts
    7,774
    Thanks
    301
    Thanked 1,263 Times in 801 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    I think the extensions are very important they help you learn spontaneous responsiveness.

    I require the extensions, and we are using the 24 technique system.
    Quality outweighs quantity every time.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    London, ON
    Posts
    1,601
    Thanks
    64
    Thanked 209 Times in 134 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Here is my latest blog (a short one) as to why I feel the extensions are an important part of the Kenpo curriculum:

    www.jamieseabrook.blogspot.com

    Any feedback on this thread is welcomed.
    I can do all things through Christ, who strengthens me.
    (Phillipians 4:13)


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Elk Grove, CA
    Posts
    4,018
    Thanks
    1,163
    Thanked 913 Times in 561 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    I have learned extensions up through blue and had, at one point, known about half of the green ones.

    Then we changed to the 5.0. There are extensions for second black and up, but I don't know exactly what's involved, since the 5.0 don't have extensions.

    I'm going to work them all though just for my own practice.

    I like a lot of the extensions. They teach a different series of movements and help with continuing the flow of motion.

    It'll be awhile before I'm back up to doing extension though. Maybe another 6 or 8 months. Then I'll be back to orange, etc.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Kennewick, WA
    Posts
    1,010
    Thanks
    143
    Thanked 711 Times in 384 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    May be a silly question, but why not teach the whole technique at one time? The AK and Tracy Dance of Death(s) are nearly identical yet plenty of Tracy pracitioners learn the whole thing for their Purple/Blue rankings. This doesn't necessarily relate to your initial question, but why have "extensions" at all?

    Lamont
    Pekiti Tirsia Kali and Kenpo Karate
    www.blackbirdmartialarts.com

    “He, who will not reason, is a bigot; he, who cannot, is a fool; and he, who dares not, is a slave.”
    ~William Drummond

    "This person is as dangerous as an IED."

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Elk Grove, CA
    Posts
    4,018
    Thanks
    1,163
    Thanked 913 Times in 561 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside View Post
    May be a silly question, but why not teach the whole technique at one time? The AK and Tracy Dance of Death(s) are nearly identical yet plenty of Tracy pracitioners learn the whole thing for their Purple/Blue rankings. This doesn't necessarily relate to your initial question, but why have "extensions" at all?

    Lamont
    On some techniques, I certainly agree with you. The extensions are very short and fairly easy, but for the lower belts, two or three moves is about what they can handle. That's one of the problems I see for brand new people learning kenpo with the 5.0, some of the orange techniques are quite long, compared to the rest of them.

    I think it's the progression of what the students can handle. Most of the brown belt techniques, for instance, are fairly long, compared to something like Twirling Wings or Evading the Storm.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


  11. #11
    jaybacca72 is offline
    KenpoTalk
    Adv. Orange Belt
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    St.Thomas Ontario CANADA
    Posts
    162
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 24 Times in 21 Posts

    Talking Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    i personally do the extensions but feel they are not really necessary to be a good kenpo practitioner but they definitely will make you better as an all around practitioner. the problem with the extensions are most people don't do the base techniques as designed well enough let alone extensions. when you reach black you can demonstrate the moves but in reality you are a good green belt because of the time needed to be seasoned with the exception of the 4hrs/day guys we are talking about the majority here.
    later
    Jason Arnold
    CANADA
    Parker/Planas Lineage
    Presas/Hartman Arnis
    Hartsell/Irish JKD

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Elk Grove, CA
    Posts
    4,018
    Thanks
    1,163
    Thanked 913 Times in 561 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaybacca72 View Post
    when you reach black you can demonstrate the moves but in reality you are a good green belt because of the time needed to be seasoned with the exception of the 4hrs/day guys we are talking about the majority here.
    So you're saying that unless you're spending 4hrs./day getting seasoned, when you reach black, you're really the equivelent of a good green belt??

    That's kind of a broad statement, don't you think?

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    My own private Idaho
    Posts
    5,277
    Thanks
    4,886
    Thanked 3,559 Times in 2,171 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by jaybacca72 View Post
    i personally do the extensions but feel they are not really necessary to be a good kenpo practitioner but they definitely will make you better as an all around practitioner. the problem with the extensions are most people don't do the base techniques as designed well enough let alone extensions. when you reach black you can demonstrate the moves but in reality you are a good green belt because of the time needed to be seasoned with the exception of the 4hrs/day guys we are talking about the majority here.
    later
    Jason Arnold
    CANADA
    Depends on how long it took to get to black. If we're talking 3-4 years and you didn't live at the dojo during that time, then yeah, you may have a point. I have an issue with anybody who can demonstrate the moves but does not fully understand what they're doing and why, getting to black belt. How long it takes to get to that point is really dependant upon the individual.

    What exactly do you mean by "seasoned"?

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Sarnia, ON, Canada
    Posts
    7,774
    Thanks
    301
    Thanked 1,263 Times in 801 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by amylong View Post
    So you're saying that unless you're spending 4hrs./day getting seasoned, when you reach black, you're really the equivelent of a good green belt??

    That's kind of a broad statement, don't you think?

    --Amy

    That is not what he is saying. He said most people who get to Black Belt should be considered good Green Belts, because many have rushed through the belts and do not fully understand all the concepts and principles in the technique. He also said there some exceptions to that statement, usually those with no live and obsess about the art and spend every second they can spare in a school practicing.
    Quality outweighs quantity every time.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Orlando, Florida
    Posts
    6,026
    Thanks
    1,199
    Thanked 1,517 Times in 909 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside View Post
    May be a silly question, but why not teach the whole technique at one time? The AK and Tracy Dance of Death(s) are nearly identical yet plenty of Tracy pracitioners learn the whole thing for their Purple/Blue rankings. This doesn't necessarily relate to your initial question, but why have "extensions" at all?

    Lamont
    That's what I've always wondered.
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." – Charles A. Beard

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Sarnia, ON, Canada
    Posts
    7,774
    Thanks
    301
    Thanked 1,263 Times in 801 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside View Post
    May be a silly question, but why not teach the whole technique at one time? The AK and Tracy Dance of Death(s) are nearly identical yet plenty of Tracy pracitioners learn the whole thing for their Purple/Blue rankings. This doesn't necessarily relate to your initial question, but why have "extensions" at all?

    Lamont
    In many instances there are enough principles in the base technique to keep a student busy for a while. The additional info in the extension in some cases would be too much for the student, especially at orange and purple belt.

    Dance of Death is officially a technique for 3rd brown in the Tracy's system
    Quality outweighs quantity every time.

  17. #17
    pete is offline
    KenpoTalk
    Green Belt
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    517
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 241 Times in 144 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside
    May be a silly question, but why not teach the whole technique at one time?
    definitely don't want to do that! that would make the student think the whole 'extended' sequence is a single response to a single attack scenario. seen it, and it ain't pretty! picture this: one guy 'attacks' with the proverbial right step through punch to somewhere east of the other guy's left ear, then proceeds to leave his outstretched arm out there for the 'defender' to go through all 17-moves of Five Swords, with full orchestration and 4-part harmony...

    no. each extension is a lesson unto itself, a technique used to deal with a change in environment or target availability. a reason why the base tech was not enough to end it.

    pete
    "Rust Never Sleeps" - N.Young.

  18. #18
    jaybacca72 is offline
    KenpoTalk
    Adv. Orange Belt
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    St.Thomas Ontario CANADA
    Posts
    162
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 24 Times in 21 Posts

    Talking Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    thanks rob you said about exactly what i would have said. as far as me making any statements they are based on my time in kenpo and seeing many kenpo people from all over the world do thier stuff and generally speaking yes you can understand and do when you reach black but believe me when i tell you about seasoning even the person training 3-4 times a week for 3 yrs won't do black like when he reaches 3rd black.
    i was the guy 10 years to black 5 days/week and i still need more time doing the base techniques and variations of them after training since 1982 consistently in kenpo and various arts.
    later
    Jason Arnold
    CANADA
    Parker/Planas Lineage
    Presas/Hartman Arnis
    Hartsell/Irish JKD

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Elk Grove, CA
    Posts
    4,018
    Thanks
    1,163
    Thanked 913 Times in 561 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Broad View Post
    That is not what he is saying. He said most people who get to Black Belt should be considered good Green Belts, because many have rushed through the belts and do not fully understand all the concepts and principles in the technique. He also said there some exceptions to that statement, usually those with no live and obsess about the art and spend every second they can spare in a school practicing.
    What you're saying Rob doesn't sound any different than what I said. I don't think it's fair to say that most people would be good green belts when they reach black. I guess the black belts I have met are substantially better than that.

    I do think that if you got your black belt in 3 or 4 years, then you rushed. And that's the instructor's fault. I wouldn't promote someone that fast no matter how often they came to class.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Baltimore, Maryland
    Posts
    2,270
    Thanks
    237
    Thanked 113 Times in 95 Posts

    Default Re: Extensions required for promotion?

    Quote Originally Posted by amylong View Post
    What you're saying Rob doesn't sound any different than what I said. I don't think it's fair to say that most people would be good green belts when they reach black. I guess the black belts I have met are substantially better than that.

    I do think that if you got your black belt in 3 or 4 years, then you rushed. And that's the instructor's fault. I wouldn't promote someone that fast no matter how often they came to class.

    --Amy
    Ok so 3 to 4 years is to fast. What if you went there 6 days a week and practiced all day on sundays LOL. When I first started this was what was going on. I practiced when I wasn't there so on and so forth. Some people can soak this stuff up and really work with it while others just go through the motions. My first instructors where getting tired of me because I was up there the whole time literally. My parents did not like it that much either. LOL. So I do not think that people rush if it takes them that long. To me if the person constanly practices, knows why they are doing what they are doing, is mature enough and just does not go through the motions than I would have no problem giving them a rank. On the other hand if I see a black belt just pitty pattying through things than I wonder.

    Ok off my soap box and back to work LOL.
    Last edited by parkerkarate; 04-05-2007 at 08:08 PM.
    "To hear is to doubt. To see is to be deceived. But to feel is to believe." -- SGM Ed Parker

    "Sic vis pacem parabellum - If you want peace, prepare for war." -- "The Punisher"


    "Praying Mantis, very good. . . For catching bugs." --Jackie Chan

    "A horse stance is great for taking a dump" --Jet Li

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Remove Ads

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)