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Thread: Form 5 Story

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    Default Form 5 Story

    When I went to the Wonder Valley Camp, I had a hidden agenda. I wanted to get a lesson of some sort on form 5. I am very well aware that there are more than a few things in form 5 that I learned incorrectly and several (mostly all) transitions that I have no clue about. (You'll notice I've never posted my form 5)

    Anyhoo, when I got there, stuff happened and then it was the end of the camp on Saturday when I was leaving. I was talking to Jason Arnold and I got up my courage and asked if he was any good at form 5. He gave me an amusing response, then told me that the one I needed to talk to was Ingmar Johansson.

    Ingmar and I had worked together during one of the seminars, but I was still hesitant to ask. He was also unavailable right then. So I just figured that it wasn't going to happen and I went out by the grass and big tree and sat outside with some other people. Graham Lelliott was there, Jason Arnold, Ed Parker Jr. and several other people were standing around talking when Ignmar came over and sat down.

    I sat there for a minute, then figured what the heck and said, "So, I hear you do a mean form 5." He gave me a humble sort of mumble and I stuttered on my words until he said, "Show me your form." I got up and felt completely self-conscious, but started.

    Within about two seconds every pair of eyes nearby was focused on me. Naturally, I completely messed up. I turned to them and told them to stop staring at me. (In an embarrassed, amused way.) Then Edmond said, "Stop ruining my father's art." It was funny, but I was totally embarrassed. I told them all to shut up (they were laughing and such.)

    I wouldn't have minded people watching if it was a kata I felt knowledgable about, but form 5 is not anywhere near that category.

    Ingmar took pity and we went into one of the rooms.

    He took me through every technique and transition in the form and gave me a ton of information. I was frustrated at myself for not knowing it and feeling totally stupid, but Ingmar was extremely kind. He even put off his dinner for a bit to help me.

    I have been practicing since and I took a short video of it so far. The camera shut off before I finished, but I got a preview and I must say....it still looks terrible. But at least it's an informed terrible. lol.

    It's funny that things I thought I was doing correctly don't look like that at all on camera. Stupid camera. lol.

    Anyhoo, that's my story of being totally embarrassed about form 5, but nevertheless being glad I asked. Thank you Jason for pointing me to Ingmar and thanks to Ingmar for giving so freely of his knowledge and time.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    I admire that. It's not so easy to approach the "Kenpo Gods" (LOL). But it just goes to show, if you don't ask-you don't get.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Michael Huffman
    1st Black, AKKI
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    profesormental is offline
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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    More importantly,

    it shows that if you ask, you get.

    Good people. I'm happy for you Amy.

    Juan M. Mercado

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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Even the great Masters all put their gi's on one leg at a time...well, maybe they don't, I don't know. However you now have the proper techniques and transitions, plus I bet some great insight into Form 5 that you didn't before. Kudos to you!

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    blfycdq is offline
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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Amy,

    One is not born a Kenpo God. One has to work hard every day. Good for you! Your desire is going to insure a wonderful form 5 for Amy. I can not wait to see your form 5 in the years to come.

    As for myself, form 5 is the most difficult to make look pleasing to the eyes due to the many transitions, as well as the elongated moves which require proper timming to make the form flow. Look at the way Tatum does the form and mark down when and where his tempo and speed change within the techniques within his form 5. This gave me an outline to follow. I found myself slowing some of my techniques down at certain points and then speeding my techniques up at other points. I saw a huge improvement and then began to feel the difference.

    There is still a clip on youtube of Ed Parker working a free style form where he borrows heavely from form 5. It was amazing to me how he could slow down certain movements and make them so dam powerful and beautiful. The tempo is what gives the form it's magic in my opinion.

    Best Regards and sorry for the rant,
    Carl

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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Congratz! It took courage to not only approach him but to perform something you were not sure of with all those big names watching.

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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    You wouldn't think asking for help would be that difficult. I think to myself that if someone asked me, I'd jump up and help and would be glad to be asked, but yet somehow I didn't give other people that same thought.

    I should've known though. I've been finding that there are a lot of people who will happily go out of their way to help others along on their kenpo journey. Duh. You'd think I'd have figured that out.

    I have so much new stuff to work on now that it's very exciting.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    I'm just wondering if you are going to tell us any of the items that were shared with you.

    Certianly, some of the secrets shared can be shared again, eh?

    I mean, even before we see a video.

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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Quote Originally Posted by michaeledward View Post
    I'm just wondering if you are going to tell us any of the items that were shared with you.

    Certianly, some of the secrets shared can be shared again, eh?

    I mean, even before we see a video.
    I haven't yet largely because then you all will know just how very much I didn't know. lol.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Very nice. I have always been impressed with the general goodness at the heart of kenpo. Looking forward to your new and improved form.

    Some things can't be "winged"...the upper level forms, and Kansas music being two of the most important.

    D.
    Clear mind, clear movement. Mastery of the Arts is mastery over the Self. That in this moment, this motion, the thoughts, memories, impulses and passions that cloud the mind must yield to the clarity of purpose, and purity of motion.

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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    I'm fishin' for a little knowledge myself, here.

    If my back allows it, I will have a private lesson with Huk this weekend. There is a good possibility we will spend our time together working on Form 5. I have learned the Form over the past 5 months, and I have not yet had the opportunity to review it with the Encyclopedia. I figure if I go in with one or two pearls of wisdom from amylong, it may be a better class.

    I haven't quite committed to 5, because I, too, and still very new to the form. I may work Form 4 again. Or, my back - which is in pretty bad shape this morning - may prevent me from taking the lesson at all.

    So, come on, amylong, help a guy out

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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Quote Originally Posted by michaeledward View Post
    I'm fishin' for a little knowledge myself, here.

    So, come on, amylong, help a guy out
    Okay, on Leap of Death, Ingmar talked about the palm heel to the head. He said that you spring up from it to the ball kick to the head. You spring from the lowest point and the snap kick is the spring from the highest point.

    Also, on Dance of Death, your arms are in sync with the final kick. In hopping crane, they are done opposite.

    You all probably knew that, but it was news to me.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


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    Talking Re: Form 5 Story

    nice post amy, i don't remember my exact words but i remember our conversation and a little bird had spoken to ingmar and paved the road,so he knew you were going to ask haha! be carefull what you wish for,i know the form and had no problem showing you it but i know ingmar loves teaching the forms and the hidden gems of them i do too but that is where his passion lies,i like techniques and exploring delivery of them. and don't feel bad ingmar had good things to say about you and the aussies went through the same thing you did the next day so you weren't the only one. thanks for the support and i look forward to working with you again.
    later
    Jason Arnold
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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Quote Originally Posted by jaybacca72 View Post
    nice post amy, a little bird had spoken to ingmar and paved the road,so he knew you were going to ask haha! be carefull what you wish for,i know the form and had no problem showing you it but i know ingmar loves teaching the forms and the hidden gems of them. and don't feel bad ingmar had good things to say about you and the aussies went through the same thing you did the next day so you weren't the only one. thanks for the support and i look forward to working with you again.

    Jason Arnold
    CANADA
    I thought maybe there was a little Canadian bird who'd said something because Ignmar came and sat down right next to me and seemed to know what my hemming and hawing meant. And he did look oddly amused.

    I'm sure you would've taught me well too, but everyone has their favorite things to teach.

    So the aussies got it too huh? That's funny. From Ingmar? If so, he must've been feeling either like a super teacher or a big bully. LOL!

    Ingmar was very kind to me and my bumbling. I do look forward to making it better and sending him the improvements.

    Thanks birdie.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Amy,
    I think it's great you asked for help with Form 5...

    I think when we stop looking for knowledge and don't ask those more knowledgeable for information, our training doesn't progress.

    I love Form 5. Will I ever be able to do it as well as GM Parker? No way, but I'm still going to have fun trying.

    For me, practicing Form 5 makes me glad I paid my dues with Form 4...

    But then again, there's always work to do on Form 4. Oh darn, back to practicing Forms 5 and 4...

    Good luck in your training.
    Humility is not thinking less of yourself. It's thinking of yourself, less.

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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Great Story of Form 5 Amy. I have one you might find amusing...or not...but here goes. I remember when I was preparing to test for 1st Black there was an instructor preparing for a 2nd Black test. We had these Sunday instructor's classes at the time that were strictly for 2nd Browns and above...and mostly for preparation for the upsoming Black Belt test. Anyway, this guy goes before his teacher and does Form 5. You can tell that he's struggling with it but he is trying his damnedest to impress his teacher. He's pouring his heart out into this form. His teacher watches (along with the rest of the room) and says very audibly "That's the worst ****ing Long 5 I've ever seen". There were around 40 of us in the room and everyone heard it including the guy's wife who was also present. Me in my infinite ignorance and lack of ability to tolerate things like that followed up with "You're right sir that form was pretty bad. Who taught him that nonsense?". Needless to say it did not go over well. But my brother and I got a kick out of the look on the "teacher's" face. I guess it didn't occur to him that the form being the "worst he's ever seen" was a direct reflection on him since he taught it to him? Talk about ego and just being an all around jerk.
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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Quote Originally Posted by KenpoJuJitsu3 View Post
    Great Story of Form 5 Amy. I guess it didn't occur to him that the form being the "worst he's ever seen" was a direct reflection on him since he taught it to him?
    That's a great story. I hope the guy who was doing the kata appreciated your intent.

    I am not smooth at all yet in my transititions, since they are almost all essentially new to me, but I at least feel better that I know mostly what to work on and can go from there.

    There's nothing worse than having no clue how to make something better.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
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    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Concerning Form 5, and the transitions ....

    As I began working my way through this form, my thighs were stressed in all sorts of new ways. Muscles that I thought were in pretty good shape from the preceeding six years of training felt as if they had never been used at all.

    When we execute some of those kicks and stomp kicks, the supporting leg must also flex. This created for me, some fierce burning in my thigh muscles.

    As for the transitions ... it seems to me that we have an awful lot of twist stances as we move from technique to technique in Form 5 - twist, unwind, twist, unwind. Some of them seem to mirror the twist/upward block we see in three or four places in Form 4, but a bit more intense in this form.

    Thanks for you help, amylong.

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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    If I find out anything else wise about the form, I'll be sure to share.

    I notice more knee problems than thigh, but then again, I've tweaked both of my knees recently. The two claws at the end of backbreaker are a wee bit painful.

    In a month or so, I'll record my five and you all can tell me what you think.

    --Amy
    The New Kenpo Continuum Book is now accepting submissions for volume 2. Our fabulous, ever-changing website is Sacramento Kenpo Karate.
    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


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    Default Re: Form 5 Story

    Long 5 is known alternately as the take down form, the point of origin form, the parallel line form, or the hand accent form. Through out the form notice the use of the pattern of claw, back knuckle, pushdown, using alternating hands.
    "To hear is to doubt. To see is to be deceived. But to feel is to believe." -- SGM Ed Parker

    "Sic vis pacem parabellum - If you want peace, prepare for war." -- "The Punisher"


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