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Thread: Do you honor other schools rank?

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    Default Do you honor other schools rank?

    If someone comes to your school with a current rank (kyu or dan) in another school or even style, do you bring them in at that rank or have them start back at white belt?

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Having been the one who has had ranks from other schools entering a new one, I've always had my rank validated.

    Usually, what they have told me is that they wanted me to be at the school for awhile for evaluation, continuing with my training and when the next testing comes around, I usually had to re-test for my current rank.

    When someone has come to our school from a different style, they usually get to keep their rank until they get their first kenpo rank.

    I did go to one kenpo school (as a third degree brown) and they wanted me to start over at white. I stayed at that school about a week.

    I guess it would just depend on how much the person remembers.

    --Amy
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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    We allow the belt to be worn until it has been met/exceeded by the equivelent belt in our school. Usually what happens is a student comes in wearing their old belt (and usually from TKD) takes a couple of classes, sees the differences, and goes back to wearing a white belt. Well, that and its embarrasing for a guy wear a red or black belt to get smoked by one of our orange or purples, 'course that is mostly from the general quality of the TKD schools in our area.

    Lamont
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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Personaly, when I move and enevitably change forms. Cause for some reason there is never a good dojo of the form I was previoulsy studying in an acceptable distance. Quite annoying really.

    I simply accept the fact that it is a differant form and in that form I have the knowladge of a whitebelt. So I typically dig out my old white.. (which is now plesently brownish grey) and start as a white. I see it as an opportunity to further re-enforce my foundation.

    I always let the instructors know my past training, I figure they will realize it soon enough when they call for a kick and I am already pretty solid with the mechanics of it.

    But I keep all my old belts and my old notes.. and most schools have a warm up room where I practice my old forms and techniques so they are not lost..

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    We honor other school's rank. The students understand that they will have that rank longer then a current student because they have to learn all the prerequisites before getting promoted again.

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by gakusei
    We honor other school's rank. The students understand that they will have that rank longer then a current student because they have to learn all the prerequisites before getting promoted again.
    That is exactly how I do it as well at my club.


    Jamie Seabrook
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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by gakusei
    We honor other school's rank. The students understand that they will have that rank longer then a current student because they have to learn all the prerequisites before getting promoted again.
    That is how I have handled that situation in the past as well.
    Quality outweighs quantity every time.

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    We really don't get kenpo transfers at our school so no, we usually don't honor another schools rank. There really aren't any other kenpo schools in the immediate area. Our system is different enough that honoring a rank from a different school wouldn't be fair to the student, especially the ones that come from one of the local McDojos. I've done introductory lessons with blue belts and green belts from these schools and their movement is typically about the yellow or orange belt level.

    That said, if a student from another school comes into the system, we'll move them along faster than we would otherwise, and give them finer detail than we normally would for new students.

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by jdinca
    We really don't get kenpo transfers at our school so no, we usually don't honor another schools rank. There really aren't any other kenpo schools in the immediate area. Our system is different enough that honoring a rank from a different school wouldn't be fair to the student, especially the ones that come from one of the local McDojos. I've done introductory lessons with blue belts and green belts from these schools and their movement is typically about the yellow or orange belt level.

    That said, if a student from another school comes into the system, we'll move them along faster than we would otherwise, and give them finer detail than we normally would for new students.
    Thats pretty much how it works with me, but I also ask really really fine detail questions... I sometimes worry I am annoying them when I get to the 15th question... but I promise they are valid questions... I'm just a perfectionist so I save more finite questions or hypotetical ones for after class.

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    At most of the schools I've gone to, it's pretty rare for someone else to come to the school from another kenpo school. Usually, like the rest of the schools, it's a student from tkd.

    Moving from one kenpo school to another, I seemed to be the exception. I never had a problem keeping my rank at any of the schools I've gone to.

    It just usually takes me six months to a year to adapt to the new school material and adjust my techniques and katas.

    --Amy
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    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    If a black belt from another school were to move into your school.....would you still let them wear the black belt they earned previously?

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Personally, I think it shows respect to the shcool to start over at white (if it's a different style/form/etc) When I switched from Jiu-Jitsu to Kenpo I dug out my white belt.

    However, a few years ago we had two students join that had recently gained the rank of green in Kajukenbo. The school owner allowed them to keep their rank and we just gave them "colored stripes" for each belt level in Kenpo until they reached green again.

    I think if the styles are similar or supposedly the same it shouldn't be a problem once verified. I can see how that could cause problems if other students rank was not recognized. They may get jealous or feel that they are not appreciated. So I guess you should probably decide to either do it one way or the other and stick with your decision regardless. Ultimately, I suppose it's up to the school owner as to which method they prefer and new students should respect their decision.

    IMHO =)
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." – Charles A. Beard

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackcatbonz
    If a black belt from another school were to move into your school.....would you still let them wear the black belt they earned previously?
    I don't see why not. So far our highest ranking transfer and been a 1st kyu.

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by gakusei
    If someone comes to your school with a current rank (kyu or dan) in another school or even style, do you bring them in at that rank or have them start back at white belt?
    I honor it, but I always ask to see their work. They still must learn everything we're doing.
    " Come with me, and I will complete your trainning."

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by Celtic_Crippler
    Personally, I think it shows respect to the shcool to start over at white (if it's a different style/form/etc) When I switched from Jiu-Jitsu to Kenpo I dug out my white belt.
    As would I if the arts were that dissimilar.

    However, a few years ago we had two students join that had recently gained the rank of green in Kajukenbo. The school owner allowed them to keep their rank and we just gave them "colored stripes" for each belt level in Kenpo until they reached green again.
    I have done this also, sometimes it has worked out, other times it has not. It can take a long time to get up to speed or meet my expectations for rank, even if I allow them to keep their previous belt ... for example coming from Chinese Kenpo to American Kenpo is not about just the material, but the ability to put the principles, concepts and theories into practical application.

    I think if the styles are similar or supposedly the same it shouldn't be a problem once verified. I can see how that could cause problems if other students rank was not recognized. They may get jealous or feel that they are not appreciated. So I guess you should probably decide to either do it one way or the other and stick with your decision regardless. Ultimately, I suppose it's up to the school owner as to which method they prefer and new students should respect their decision.

    IMHO =)
    I have tried it both ways, and have had the jealousy issue arise. It can be worked around, especially when the practitioner has a certain amount of proficency apparent. If they are good, then it is evident to the other students where they belong. One of the traps in this is that you cannot play favorites to the new guy, or vice versa, without creating more problems yourself.

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    I agree that other students will quickly realize where the new person belongs.

    My favorite saying is, "It's not what you show; it's what you know that counts."

    If everyone came together without wearing their belts, it seems it would become clear very quickly who knows what.

    I went to one kenpo school where they didn't wear belts. I worked out with a couple of students, one of whom I assumed was about an orange belt and the other....maybe blue at best.

    I was shocked to discover that they were both first degree brown belts.

    --Amy
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    I'm a member of the Universal Life Church and the ULC Seminary. I'm also a Sacramento Wedding Minister and Disc Jockey
    New Cool (free) kenpo tool bar: http://KenpoKarate.OurToolbar.com/


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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by amylong
    I went to one kenpo school where they didn't wear belts. I worked out with a couple of students, one of whom I assumed was about an orange belt and the other....maybe blue at best.

    I was shocked to discover that they were both first degree brown belts.

    --Amy
    That brings up another subject. Some people advocate the use of a belt system and some don't. Do you feel that the use of several belt levels between white and black motivates the student to do better? It wasn't always so. Or are you just saying those students weren't up to par with the standards you set for your students? =) If so, do you feel belt ranks are unimportant in the grand scheme of things?
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." – Charles A. Beard

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by Celtic_Crippler
    That brings up another subject. Some people advocate the use of a belt system and some don't. Do you feel that the use of several belt levels between white and black motivates the student to do better? It wasn't always so. Or are you just saying those students weren't up to par with the standards you set for your students? =) If so, do you feel belt ranks are unimportant in the grand scheme of things?
    Back in the koryu, you only had one teacher for many many years so there wasn't much need for belts. Now even some traditional schools are using colored belts so guest instructors or when you attend seminars the instructor has an idea of your skill level.

    Case in point, I was training in Aikido under the AAA for a while and that is the reason they started using belts (seminars). I was at a seminar and working with others and then a senior student ask me, "your not a white belt are you?"

    I feel it is good to see advancement; but, some people always go to far. It is up to the instructor to teach students it is more about the journey then getting a black belt or the next belt. Its not always easy.

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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Belt colors do validate the progress of students. It's good for their egos to know they are progressing.

    It can also give you a chance to grow into a belt. I know that I improved quite a bit when I got my black belt. Maybe I strived to work harder to live up to the honor or maybe it was just my confidence that improved, but I definitely got better in both my skill level and my ability to teach.

    With those other students I mentioned, I think it just may have been the quality of the instruction at that school.

    I think belts are good for a variety of reasons (seminars and guest instructors, as mentioned), but they aren't perfect. Since there is no absolute minimum standard of skill, there can't be much standardization with ranks.

    Also, some people, no matter how much they practice and train, are only going to go so far. We wouldn't want to withhold validation for their progress.

    --Amy
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    Default Re: Do you honor other schools rank?

    Quote Originally Posted by amylong
    Also, some people, no matter how much they practice and train, are only going to go so far. We wouldn't want to withhold validation for their progress.
    What does this mean? That everyone deserves a black belt, as long as they keeping working at it? In the words of my schools head instructor "desire is not enough."

    Lamont
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