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Thread: Transitions in forms

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    Anoise is offline
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    Default Transitions in forms

    Is there a secret to making them smooth? I'm having a VERY difficult time with long 3. I just can't seem to make it flow.
    Any suggestions? For this and other forms as well.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Just relax, and try puting it to music

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Bingo! Relaxation is the biggest aid to flow. Remeber that proper movement in Kenpo is a balance between tension and relaxation.

    Respects,
    Bill Parsons
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    www.trianglekenpo.com

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    You are most welcome,

    Remember that kenpo is the study of motion, the self defense is only a by-product of that study.

    Deepest respect

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    I'd have to see what you were doing specificly, but avoid locking out anything and see if that helps.
    Sean

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    long 3 is a tough form to make 'flow' because of all the returning to horse stance after each sequence. if you settle into a horse stance, you basically root through both feet into the ground, making it an extra effort to break inertia upon movement into the next.

    one trick is to keep the energy flowing by avoiding 'double weighting' on the horse stance. in other words, physically assume a good horse stance, but maintain an energy flow through a slight weight shift in to one leg, then reverse it to move into the next sequence. this will empty the leg that steps and feels like a soft spring-like rebounding relationship with the floor.

    hope this helps...
    pete
    "Rust Never Sleeps" - N.Young.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    I am not EPAK but I find doing a form much more slowly that normal helps quite a bit. Each time speed up just a tad, rinse and repeat---
    The above is just my opinion.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by Anoise View Post
    Is there a secret to making them smooth? I'm having a VERY difficult time with long 3. I just can't seem to make it flow.
    Any suggestions? For this and other forms as well.
    For each transition, change your point of attention. Think about the one technique and when it's done, shift your attention to the next attack. That might help.

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    Lightbulb Re: Transitions in forms

    Try performing the entire kata with isometric tension, at a severely slow pace, (think tai chi on vallium), this helps engrain the specifics into muscle memory. Next perform the kata again, without any power, but with an emphasis on continuous, nonstop flow...like holding a single musical note throught the entire form. Then release all tension whatsover and perform the kata as if it were a race for your very life. Each repetition focusing on an entirely different aspect of the form. Finally, go back and perform your kata at a normal, realistic level of speed and power. I think you may find that alternating the way you execute the exact same movements, will subtly (or not so subtly) change the overall flow, speed, power and esthetics of the kata. This is something I routinely do with both my students and myself in preparing for either competition or testing. Experiment with this technique, you have very little to lose, except for a bit of time and sweat.

    Good luck.
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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by KenpoChanger View Post
    I'd have to see what you were doing specificly, but avoid locking out anything and see if that helps.
    Sean
    When I put my arm out for crossing talons...that just feels weird.
    The worst for me is doing thrusting wedge...coming back to center, then turning to the other side.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by pete View Post
    long 3 is a tough form to make 'flow' because of all the returning to horse stance after each sequence. if you settle into a horse stance, you basically root through both feet into the ground, making it an extra effort to break inertia upon movement into the next.

    one trick is to keep the energy flowing by avoiding 'double weighting' on the horse stance. in other words, physically assume a good horse stance, but maintain an energy flow through a slight weight shift in to one leg, then reverse it to move into the next sequence. this will empty the leg that steps and feels like a soft spring-like rebounding relationship with the floor.

    hope this helps...
    pete
    oohhh I'll try this tonight. I dont have class until next week, but I can practice at home

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by amylong View Post
    For each transition, change your point of attention. Think about the one technique and when it's done, shift your attention to the next attack. That might help.

    --Amy
    I feel like I'm tripping over myself.
    I'll try that, and make that focus change as short as possible.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by SifuDangeRuss View Post
    Try performing the entire kata with isometric tension, at a severely slow pace, (think tai chi on vallium), this helps engrain the specifics into muscle memory. Next perform the kata again, without any power, but with an emphasis on continuous, nonstop flow...like holding a single musical note throught the entire form. Then release all tension whatsover and perform the kata as if it were a race for your very life. Each repetition focusing on an entirely different aspect of the form. Finally, go back and perform your kata at a normal, realistic level of speed and power. I think you may find that alternating the way you execute the exact same movements, will subtly (or not so subtly) change the overall flow, speed, power and esthetics of the kata. This is something I routinely do with both my students and myself in preparing for either competition or testing. Experiment with this technique, you have very little to lose, except for a bit of time and sweat.

    Good luck.
    That might help. I tend to memorize as quick as I can then try and do the form as if I'm being attacked.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    As a start, stay relaxed, keep your knees bent and step through the center. Have your head targeted on the next move before you move that direction.
    Be careful what you say, some may take it the wrong way.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    I tried it very slow and paused at each technique. What a huge difference.
    I think if I keep doing it slow and work on anticipating the transitions and making weight adjustments to my stances It should flow better when I do it faster.
    Thanks all so much for your help!!!

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by Anoise View Post
    When I put my arm out for crossing talons...that just feels weird.
    The worst for me is doing thrusting wedge...coming back to center, then turning to the other side.
    Long 3 is a hard form, also it isnt a form that is ment for full application. You will se a major difference when you study Long 4 and up.

    Respectfully

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by MARSHALLS KENPO View Post
    Long 3 is a hard form, also it isnt a form that is ment for full application. You will se a major difference when you study Long 4 and up.

    Respectfully
    I think that my be my biggest stumbling block with this. My dance background wants this to flow like a choreographed dance instead of a series of techniques.
    Now I wish I paid more attention at the tournament of the people doing long 3

    Thank you for your help

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by Anoise View Post
    I think that my be my biggest stumbling block with this. My dance background wants this to flow like a choreographed dance instead of a series of techniques.
    Now I wish I paid more attention at the tournament of the people doing long 3

    Thank you for your help
    I have won a tournament with this form. Think of the power points of the tech and not the continuity.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    SifuDangeRuss's advise is very good, as well as AmyLong's. When I do forms I try to break the form down into the different attacks and then either I will ask someone to attack me the way the form anticipates or I will use my imaginary BOB. I go through each attack/defense this way in order to "know" what I'm doing in sequential order. Then after I understand it and my body understands what I need it to do, I go through several times just with the steps/feet movement. I then go and add the hand movements (attacks/defenses). Once that is done, I follow the same basic advise the SifuDangeRuss gave, along with AmyLong's. I usually do 5 reps of each way though. I'll do the form 5 times very slow (like I'm moving through molases on a cold day, then I'll do 5 forms, not so much focusing on indistinction of movements, but a more circular feel (like the tai chi seen at parks). After that (and a little break because you'll need a breather), I'll do the form 5 times at normal pace and movement. I'll then sit down, write down any questions I have, and either see if I can't work them myself or I'll ask my Sensei later on. Believe it or not I do the same thing for techniques also. I found it works for me so I use it. It's not for everyone but to each their own.

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    Default Re: Transitions in forms

    Quote Originally Posted by Anoise View Post
    When I put my arm out for crossing talons...that just feels weird.
    The worst for me is doing thrusting wedge...coming back to center, then turning to the other side.
    Go right into the reversal. You want them to reach for it in the street; so, all you are really doing is dropping the arm. As soon as you feel an equal weight distribution on the horse just go. Flow is the absence of lock out; so, while I appreciate averyone telling you to go slow, just whip through it really fast a few times. Try using figure eights and big circles until you can tighten it up. You are a raging river going through targets, not around or to. The best way to achieve flow, I am told, is by using bodies, and very understanding ones at that. LOL
    Sean

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