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    Default conquering shield

    nomatter how many times you see a seemingly easy technique, and understand what's going on, it is so much harder to do when you first learn it. this has got to be a good example, with the timing/coordination involved.
    Brian Sheets
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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Can you describe the technique? I'm not familiar with Conquering Shield

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by KirkS View Post
    Can you describe the technique? I'm not familiar with Conquering Shield
    Dunno if the AKKI version is same or near, but here is A version, from the Casa de Kenpo crew on youtube.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAzQHdFxbV4

    At least, it provides a starting point. Fast-forward to 2:35 to get to the tech.

    D.
    Clear mind, clear movement. Mastery of the Arts is mastery over the Self. That in this moment, this motion, the thoughts, memories, impulses and passions that cloud the mind must yield to the clarity of purpose, and purity of motion.

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    yeah it is a little different with the timing of the kick and block.. thx tho
    Brian Sheets
    VKKSI Kenpo 1st Black

    Only a warrior chooses pacifism; others are condemned to it." ~ Unknown
    "Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting, but never hit soft." Theodore Roosevelt



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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Dave in da house View Post
    Dunno if the AKKI version is same or near, but here is A version, from the Casa de Kenpo crew on youtube.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAzQHdFxbV4

    At least, it provides a starting point. Fast-forward to 2:35 to get to the tech.

    D.
    Welllll, if you want we can start with the A proper attack.
    "Nothing is more dangerous than the conscientiously ignorant, or the sincerely stupid." - Martin Luther King Jr.

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Welllll, if you want we can start with the A proper attack.
    Nah. That means thinking, and I'm too lazy.
    Clear mind, clear movement. Mastery of the Arts is mastery over the Self. That in this moment, this motion, the thoughts, memories, impulses and passions that cloud the mind must yield to the clarity of purpose, and purity of motion.

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Dave in da house View Post
    Nah. That means thinking, and I'm too lazy.
    So I've noticed based on your class attendance. Thought about you last night when we were doing the manipulations, hanging locks, arm bar takedowns, and pins. Nah, nah, nah nah na.
    "Nothing is more dangerous than the conscientiously ignorant, or the sincerely stupid." - Martin Luther King Jr.

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    So I've noticed based on your class attendance. Thought about you last night when we were doing the manipulations, hanging locks, arm bar takedowns, and pins. Nah, nah, nah nah na.
    Darnit. Missed some good s&#t.
    Clear mind, clear movement. Mastery of the Arts is mastery over the Self. That in this moment, this motion, the thoughts, memories, impulses and passions that cloud the mind must yield to the clarity of purpose, and purity of motion.

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Welllll, if you want we can start with the A proper attack.
    The vid said it was a "stiff arm lapel grab". Looked a little half- hearted to me.
    I was taught the grab was more of a control to set up a punch.
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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikael151 View Post
    The vid said it was a "stiff arm lapel grab". Looked a little half- hearted to me.
    I was taught the grab was more of a control to set up a punch.
    Yes sir, I believe you are correct. Stiff arm pushing, to control the distance for a crossing or straight right hand to the face.

    It's been my experience in watching what some do with the scenarios that they, have a "specific execution" of a technique that the know, and therefore they modify the attacks to fit the technique, or never consider the attacks as they actually relate to the techniques.

    In the presented video example, if the attack were carried out as described, than the defensive response depicted, would not have been possible. Therefore, as a lesson of defense, or offense, the example is useless.

    Now the attack must be examined in meticulous detail, followed by a reasonable response that would actually fit, and work in the scenario.
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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Yes sir, I believe you are correct. Stiff arm pushing, to control the distance for a crossing or straight right hand to the face.

    It's been my experience in watching what some do with the scenarios that they, have a "specific execution" of a technique that the know, and therefore they modify the attacks to fit the technique, or never consider the attacks as they actually relate to the techniques.

    In the presented video example, if the attack were carried out as described, than the defensive response depicted, would not have been possible. Therefore, as a lesson of defense, or offense, the example is useless.

    Now the attack must be examined in meticulous detail, followed by a reasonable response that would actually fit, and work in the scenario.
    As always, sir, you make a lot of sense!

    With a stiff left hand lapel controlling grab, it would be very difficult to rotate from right to left, especially when considering you are already pinning the attacker's hand to your lapel/front shoulder area.
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    Default Re: conquering shield

    I would say the principle of "With" is missing.

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Eastcoastkenpoist View Post
    I would say the principle of "With" is missing.
    With is not a principle. It is a conceptual idea, and at best a philosophical suggestion in some circumstances. None of it makes sense until you meticulously nail down the attack. That is the major problem with motion based Kenpo. It simply takes everything as if things just "happen." Building a self defense technique scenario is as complex as building a car piece-by-piece. You can't just take for granted that it will go when you push on the accelerator, nor stop because you say you're going to put on the brakes. Both actions have and require so many other things to be in-place and functioning smoothly with each other to make the simple happen. Nothing "just happens," and everything is deliberate.
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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Greetings.

    The thing with the "stiff arm lapel grab" is that it has several factors in terms of intent and the effect on the defender.

    This is what I mean.

    Let's say that in Lone Kimono, the attack is a grab that has intent to intimidate and control so that a possible punch could follow, so the grab is also a push that grabs the kimono, your chest skin, and whatever hair you have there.

    Another variant of the attack, can be a lunge to grab and punch or go for a grapple, so the grab not only pulls, but pulls down to stabilize the posture of the attacker to hit you. This happens if the confrontation is in a crowded place and the attacker really wants to clock you for some reason and is really desperate to get you and lunges, extending the grabbing arm. This is normally preceded by loud screaming about you and your momma, so SL-3 material could cover it before getting to the grab...

    Another attack can be an aggressive lapel grab that turns you (a.k.a. controls your width), so it is not the same mechanism for stepping back as in Lone Kimono (controls depth), so it merits another technique scenario. It might not be to intimidate, but to punch you immediately after gaining some control.

    Thus again, getting into this discussion merits the specific attack condition so that a meaningful response in level 4 range using SL-4 mechanisms to optimally Survive the Initial Attack.

    I'm just thinking and speculating here. I ask of those that are interested to do the same as to participate in the process of examining techniques and learning much more about what you already know.

    Sincerely,

    Juan Mercado-Robles
    Drain Bamaged by SL-4 techs...

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    With is not a principle. It is a conceptual idea, and at best a philosophical suggestion in some circumstances. None of it makes sense until you meticulously nail down the attack. That is the major problem with motion based Kenpo. It simply takes everything as if things just "happen." Building a self defense technique scenario is as complex as building a car piece-by-piece. You can't just take for granted that it will go when you push on the accelerator, nor stop because you say you're going to put on the brakes. Both actions have and require so many other things to be in-place and functioning smoothly with each other to make the simple happen. Nothing "just happens," and everything is deliberate.
    One thing happening "With" or at the same time as another thing is conceptual only?

    Do you try to complicate things just for complications sake?

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    just do some push hands and this and all other kenpo techniques will start to make sense, regardless of the attack.

    pete
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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Eastcoastkenpoist View Post
    One thing happening "With" or at the same time as another thing is conceptual only?

    Do you try to complicate things just for complications sake?
    He's pointing out that there is a difference between a "concept", "principle", and "theory".

    Hope this helps.
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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Eastcoastkenpoist View Post
    One thing happening "With" or at the same time as another thing is conceptual only?

    Do you try to complicate things just for complications sake?
    In this instance, he might be right.
    Sean

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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Eastcoastkenpoist View Post
    One thing happening "With" or at the same time as another thing is conceptual only?

    Do you try to complicate things just for complications sake?
    Do you seek to make simple, what is in reality complex? The truth is, a real black belt will take the complex and make it look simple, but a real black belt also knows it isn't, no matter how simple it looks. Those that do not know, or do not seek to learn the difference, will remain ignorant. Everyone has a choice.

    Surely most will readily see that "with" is just an idea. Nothing more or less.

    "It is a wise man who knows, what he does not know."
    "A man does not begin to become great until he comes to the realization that what he knows is very little."
    Pride and ego are the anesthesia of ignorance." - Ed Parker Sr.
    "Nothing is more dangerous than the conscientiously ignorant, or the sincerely stupid." - Martin Luther King Jr.

    "Knowledge speaks but wisdom listens." - Ed Parker Sr.

    "It's much easier to quote, than to know." - Ron Chapél


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    Default Re: conquering shield

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Do you seek to make simple, what is in reality complex? The truth is, a real black belt will take the complex and make it look simple, but a real black belt also knows it isn't, no matter how simple it looks. Those that do not know, or do not seek to learn the difference, will remain ignorant. Everyone has a choice.

    Surely most will readily see that "with" is just an idea. Nothing more or less.

    "It is a wise man who knows, what he does not know."
    "A man does not begin to become great until he comes to the realization that what he knows is very little."
    Pride and ego are the anesthesia of ignorance." - Ed Parker Sr.
    Some people think that life is complicated, my teacher tells me, and I believe that it is not, it is simple and difficult, but not complicated.

    This goes hand and hand with, " Sophistication is simplicity compounded"

    Some principles need to be learned and remembered thes we find on our Kenposcope and Cycle of Considerations others we train and internalize and don't need to think about.

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