Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 31 of 31
Like Tree3Likes

Thread: Has anyone Else ready this article?

  1. #21
    Doc's Avatar
    Doc
    Doc is offline
    AKI Contributing Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    8,418
    Thanks
    4,260
    Thanked 14,897 Times in 5,568 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrBunny View Post
    Dude had an ad for martial arts secrets in the back of comic books right by the X-Ray glasses... forgive me if I have my doubts... i'm a cynic and all.
    Yeah that was John. He also would take to wearing formal wear with a top hat and cape and cane from time-to-time. His actual profession was as a hairdresser. However, he was indeed one hell of a martial artist and ass-kicker. I wouldn't confuse any of these things he did with his ability to get in your ass.
    "Nothing is more dangerous than the conscientiously ignorant, or the sincerely stupid." - Martin Luther King Jr.

    "Knowledge speaks but wisdom listens." - Ed Parker Sr.

    "It's much easier to quote, than to know." - Ron Chapél


    www.MSUACF.com

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Doc For This Useful Post:

    Dr. Dave in da house (2 Weeks Ago),Star Dragon (4 Weeks Ago)

  3. #22
    Big Pat is offline
    KenpoTalk
    White Belt
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    San Diego County
    Posts
    21
    Thanks
    17
    Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Counte Dante
    If I remember correctly he had some involvement with the "Dojo Wars" that took place back in the day on the East Coast.

    EKP RIP

    Big Pat




    Counte Dante






    John Keehan AKA Count Dante
    & Origins of Black Dragon Fighting Society Name
    Inspired by the fact Samurai warriors in order to attain a sense of balance between hard and soft lifestyles often practiced flower arranging or calligraphy, John Keehan did likewise. He artistically expressed himself as a hair stylist. He worked on some of the hair designs for Playboy models of the time that gave rise to his flamboyant personification and helped launch him to the forefront of martial art history.
    John Keehan AKA Count Dante was born in Beverly, Illinois, on February 2, 1939, and died May 25th, 1975. His unexpected death at age 34 is the cause of much deliberation. It is attributed to a perforated stomach allegedly caused by either a bleeding ulcer, toxic poisoning or “Dim Mak” poison hand technique that resulted in his untimely death. A strong indicator foul play may be the case is the fact his body is allegedly exhumed and autopsied numerous times and he is buried in an unmarked grave.
    In his youth Keehan boxed at Johnny Coulon's 63rd Street gym. After graduating from high school he joined the USMC reserves and later the US army, where he learned and taught hand-to-hand combat and jujitsu techniques. He joined the merchant marines and traveled to China where he trained under various martial arts masters. All this occurred during the infancy of Western interest in Asian martial arts, in the 1950s. Once there, his association with former Kokuryukai, Black Dragon Society members in Chicago enabled him to compete in no-holds-barred full contact Kumite (Bloodsport film style matches).
    Most notable of the early masters he trained with was Sensei, Robert Trias and Kokuryukai Black Dragon Society member and its former full contact Kumite Champion, Sanzo Tanaka (homage paid him in the martial art classic films, 1988 Bloodsport and Jet Li’s Fearless).
    John Keehan was the co-founder and mid-west director of the United States Karate Association (USKA) until 1962. He resigned from the organization in 1964 due to civil rights issues with the USKA patronizing “whites only” facilities in conducting its tournaments as well as refusal to promote minorities other than Asians to rank of Black Belt. To this end, Keehan broke ranks and formed the first USA racially integrated martial art association - The World Karate Federation (NOTE: In 1990 a new World Karate Federation unassociated with Keehan's was formed).
    In Chicago, John Keehan co-promoted the first open to the public full-contact Kumite Bloodsport style mixed martial arts tournament held at the University of Chicago, on July 28, 1963. Many other such tournaments were hosted by him during the 1960s, pairing practitioners of different styles against one another.
    Joining Keehan was a group of promoters and together they formed the International Fighting Arts Association in cooperation with former members of the Black Dragon Society, who sponsored the event since 1905, in Manchuria, China. Black Belt magazine, November 1980, John Stewart, Kumite: A Learning Experience, points out “while not a publicity seeking organization the IFAA is far from being a secret organization, as romanticized.
    During the nationwide racial strife of the 1960s, John Keehan was one of the first and few American martial art instructors to openly teach non-Asian minorities. In defiance of the racial prejudice dominating the scene thus preventing minorities from having the ability to access Asian martial arts forming an exclusive martial art clique, Keehan joined forces with like minded instructors and some of his senior students and together they established the Black Dragon Fighting Society, whose membership is open to all.
    To spoof the pomp and elitism prevalent on the part of martial art community with their oppressing minorities other than Asian, in 1967, Keehan legally changed his name to Count Juan Raphael Danté. DONE AS A JOKE… mocking the invented pasts and historical lineages of many of his so called peers who then made everyone refer to them as Grandmasters.
    John Keehan by his physical appearance is of obvious Irish dissent who began sarcastically explaining (in an Irish baroque at times) the name change occurred because his parents fled Spain during the Spanish Civil War, changed their names, and obscured their noble heritage in order to effectively hide in America. All the while knowing the surname Dante is in fact of Italian origin. Keehan having taken the name (Count) Dantès from the protagonist of Dumas' 1844 The Count of Monte Cristo, as Keehan saw his role as avenging the wrongs being committed against him and minorities at the height of the civil rights movement.
    He further mocked traditional martial arts lock out of minorities by promoting his alter ego Count Dante via comic book ads as the Deadliest Man Alive. One had only to mail order for his instructional booklet World's Deadliest Fighting Secrets (in which he outlined the "Dance of Death") and they also received a free Black Dragon Fighting Society membership card because all are welcome to study and feel they had a right to belong. These comic book ads account for much of Count Dante's lasting notoriety in pop culture. They read:
    Yes, this is the DEADLIEST and most TERRIFYING fighting art known to man–and WITHOUT EQUAL. Its MAIMING, MUTILATING, DISFIGURING, PARALYZING and CRIPPLING techniques are known by only a few people in the world. An expert at DIM MAK could easily kill many Judo, Karate, Kung Fu, Aikido, and Gung Fu experts at one time with only finger-tip pressure using his murderous POISON HAND WEAPONS. Instructing you step by step thru each move in this manual is none other than COUNT DANTE–“THE DEADLIEST MAN WHO EVER LIVED” (THE CROWN PRINCE OF DEATH).
    According to legend the death touch/ Tibetan Iron Palm strike was allegedly administered to Keehan over his tendency to associate with well known western organized crime figures, bringing dishonor to his clan. Nonetheless, with his death a young protégé Frank Dux competed in Keehan’s place in the coveted and legendary Kokuryukai, Black Dragon Society Kumite events. The event which forms the basis of the 1988 classic film based on true events in the life of Frank Dux, Bloodsport.
    ORIGINS OF BLACK DRAGON FIGHTING SOCIETY NAME:
    Contrary to poorly researched and supervised internet reference sites, like Wikipedia, The Black Dragon Fighting Society founded by Count Dante does have a historical connection to the Kokuryukai, Japanese Black Dragon Society, a fascist organization whose members taught and invited Keehan to participate in their closed door events as well as helped finance his US full contact events. The Kokuryukai, Japanese Black Dragon Society having renamed itself in the 1960’s The Black Dragon Club.
    The Kokuryukai, Japanese Black Dragon Society murdered its way across the globe and established its 1st presence in Chicago and Los Angeles in the 1930’s. They viewed racial inequality and strife as a vulnerability they could exploit to benefit their intelligence and criminal organization loyal to imperial Japan. Thus, they began exploiting civil rights movement by secretly teaching Judo/Jujitsu to minorities after hours, explaining they were janitors. Like they did in Russia and Manchuria, they also formed Judo clubs on military installations until the Kokuryukai plans were discovered and several members, jailed.
    Notwithstanding, Kokuryukai agents were instrumental just as they were in the Japanese victory over Russia with the surprise attack at Port Arthur in pulling off the surprise attack on American Fleet, anchored in Pearl Harbor Dec. 7th, 1941. The devastating surprise attack combined with the arrest scandal led to the internment of all Japanese residing in the USA. This included all American citizens of Japanese dissent.
    The Black Dragon Fighting Society original members owe their name to the fact while Black Dragon name became synonymous with elitist ideals of fascism and imperialistic goals of Japan, they reject and fight against any form of elitism that includes racial discrimination and thus they took the name - Black Dragon Fighting Society. Commemorating they learned their fighting skills and are themselves the offspring of Black Dragons but nonetheless, oppose their elitist fascist ideals.
    WARNNING-SEPERATING SUBSTANTIVE FACT FROM FICTION:

    • A common Wikipedia and internet myth is The Black Dragon Fighting Society that Keehan founded came under the directorship of a personally chosen protégé and successor, William V. Aguiar. Aguiar died in January, 2005. The fact is, Aguiar received minimal training and merely co-hosted seminars and tournaments along with Keehan in the name of the The Black Dragon Fighting Society, in the 1970’s.


    • The Black Dragon Fighting Society is a fraternal organization composed of like minded individuals whose membership and alliances cannot be willed nor its IP/name, as it belongs to all the originators and their legacy.


    • The Black Dragon Fighting Society is NOT led by Bill Aguiar III or associated with him in any way, given he was not born when it was created, he has never been ranked or recognized as a member of The Black Dragon Fighting Society even by his own father, now deceased.


    • Bill Aquiar III is merely the co-founder of his own online blog where he has been exposed on the internet as making false and misleading representations as well as engaged in misconduct unbecoming anyone who is an actual member of the Black Dragon Fighting Society.


    • It is erroneously stated in Wikipedia Aguiar III and his Fall River Mass hosts the Official Black Dragon Fighting Society website, as well. THE WEBSITE EXISTS UNDER THE DIRECTION OF THE ORIGINAL BLACK DRAGON FIGHTING SOCIETY MEMBERS, AS STATED ON THE HOMEPAGE.

    DOCUMENTARY FILM MAKER FLOYD WEBB AS DO ALL THE ORIGINAL BDFS MEMBERS, WARRANT, FOLLOWING JOHN KEEHAN’S UNTIMELY DEATH PROMOTIONAL AND HISTORICAL MATERIALS WENT MISSING THAT SEEMINGLY REAPPEAR AND HAVE COME TO BE IN THE POSSESSION OF OTHERS ATTEMPTING TO USE IT AS SOME KIND OF PROOF AS TO THEIR LEGITIMACY.
    THEREFORE, TO ASSIST THE PUBLIC AND GUARD THEM AGAINST FALLING VICTIMS TO FRAUD WE MAKE AVAILABLE FOR VIEWING THE OFFICIAL MEMBERS LIST, AS POSTED.

  4. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Dundalk Md
    Posts
    1,775
    Thanks
    197
    Thanked 977 Times in 612 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    Yeah that was John. He also would take to wearing formal wear with a top hat and cape and cane from time-to-time. His actual profession was as a hairdresser. However, he was indeed one hell of a martial artist and ass-kicker. I wouldn't confuse any of these things he did with his ability to get in your ass.

    Fair but here is a question... does the ability to effectively "get in your ass" (the implications are staggeringly funny) make one a good or even skilled martial artist? Or a master? or someone who should be considered a master?

    Bun bun
    "Do you have any bactine? Some of this blood is mine."

    "Dear Die-ary, today I stuffed some dolls full of dead rats I put in the blender. I'm wondering if, maybe, there really is something wrong with me."

    -JTHM

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to MrBunny For This Useful Post:

    KirkS (01-15-2020)

  6. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Raleigh, NC, USA
    Posts
    1,129
    Thanks
    1,167
    Thanked 1,247 Times in 606 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrBunny View Post
    Fair but here is a question... does the ability to effectively "get in your ass" (the implications are staggeringly funny) make one a good or even skilled martial artist?
    I’m gonna go out a limb here and say that based on who used that phraseology, it probably does.

    Respects,

    Bill Parsons
    Triangle Kenpo Institute
    www.trianglekenpo.com

    "I know Kenpo!" "Cool... do you know how to use it?"

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to bdparsons For This Useful Post:

    KirkS (01-15-2020)

  8. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Dundalk Md
    Posts
    1,775
    Thanks
    197
    Thanked 977 Times in 612 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by bdparsons View Post
    I’m gonna go out a limb here and say that based on who used that phraseology, it probably does.

    Respects,

    Bill Parsons
    Triangle Kenpo Institute

    See I disagree.. could not an aggressive brawler also do the same? Does a good fighter equate to a good martial artist? This then gets to the ideological definition of a martial artist....

    Thoughts?

    Bunny
    "Do you have any bactine? Some of this blood is mine."

    "Dear Die-ary, today I stuffed some dolls full of dead rats I put in the blender. I'm wondering if, maybe, there really is something wrong with me."

    -JTHM

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to MrBunny For This Useful Post:

    KirkS (01-15-2020)

  10. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Raleigh, NC, USA
    Posts
    1,129
    Thanks
    1,167
    Thanked 1,247 Times in 606 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrBunny View Post
    See I disagree.. could not an aggressive brawler also do the same? Does a good fighter equate to a good martial artist? This then gets to the ideological definition of a martial artist....

    Thoughts?

    Bunny
    Well, I was being a bit facetious. Trying to inject a little levity, very little obviously. But you want to get all philosophical-like.

    I would ask, for arguments sake, what’s the definition of a good fighter?

    Respects,

    Bill Parsons
    Triangle Kenpo Institute
    www.trianglekenpo.com

    "I know Kenpo!" "Cool... do you know how to use it?"

  11. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Dundalk Md
    Posts
    1,775
    Thanks
    197
    Thanked 977 Times in 612 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by bdparsons View Post
    Well, I was being a bit facetious. Trying to inject a little levity, very little obviously. But you want to get all philosophical-like.

    I would ask, for arguments sake, what’s the definition of a good fighter?

    Respects,

    Bill Parsons
    Triangle Kenpo Institute
    A good point.. one can be a good technical fighter but not be effective in ones personal defense. Then again.. one can be an effective fighter without being a good fighter.. that then can be interpreted by intentions. But lets try to limit it to Martial arts..

    I put out there that I do not believe that John aka Count Dante is/was a master martial artist because I attribute more than fighting skill as a prerequisite to the title of Master.

    Bunbun
    "Do you have any bactine? Some of this blood is mine."

    "Dear Die-ary, today I stuffed some dolls full of dead rats I put in the blender. I'm wondering if, maybe, there really is something wrong with me."

    -JTHM

  12. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to MrBunny For This Useful Post:

    bdparsons (4 Weeks Ago),KirkS (01-16-2020)

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    2,770
    Thanks
    1,623
    Thanked 3,122 Times in 1,474 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    One can be an effective fighter with raw talent, aggression, athleticism, and/or just plain meanness, with very little or even no actual martial training. This person is a good fighter, but definitely not a master of martial arts. He would have little or nothing to teach to anyone who does not share those same personal attributes. And a person who shares those same attributes likely doesn’t need any instruction either.

    so I agree that a good fighter does not automatically equate to a skilled or knowledgeable martial artist.
    Michael


    de gustibus non disputante est.
    Negative Douche Bag Number One

  14. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to flying crane For This Useful Post:

    bdparsons (4 Weeks Ago),KirkS (01-16-2020),MrBunny (01-16-2020),punisher73 (4 Weeks Ago)

  15. #29
    Doc's Avatar
    Doc
    Doc is offline
    AKI Contributing Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    8,418
    Thanks
    4,260
    Thanked 14,897 Times in 5,568 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by Star Dragon View Post
    I don't know if the story is true and I am not sure why it would matter much. Mr. Parker is renowned not for his exemplary moral conduct, but for his achievements in the martial arts world. If you expect that world to be inhabited by saints, you are in for a shock once you learn the truth.

    To me, the more interesting statement in the quoted text concerns Mr. Parker "teaching the Heian forms from Shotokan karate, this as illustrated by one of his earliest books." Now I know Mr. Parker's early books. I also know Shotokan karate.

    While it is true that forms can be interpreted in a variety of ways, it is hard to make 1:1 comparisons between what is in the Heian kata and Mr. Parker's early self-defence techniques as shown in his 1960 book Kenpo Karate: The Law of the Fist and the Empty Hand. Even though there is no doubt that the Kenpo he learned on Hawaii had some of its roots in Okinawan shurite style karate, as taugt by Mutsu Mizuho and Choki Motobu.

    So the abovementioned statement somehow intrigues me. In the unlikely case anybody here has further insights to share, I invite you to do so.
    You're right. Sifu Chow didn't teach forms, and the rumor comes from Mitose who knew a little of the beginner Okinawan forms, but Mr. Parker never taught them. He, in conjunction with Chinese Masters like Sifu Jimmy Woo, and Sifu Ark Wong developed some basic forms that changed over time.
    "Nothing is more dangerous than the conscientiously ignorant, or the sincerely stupid." - Martin Luther King Jr.

    "Knowledge speaks but wisdom listens." - Ed Parker Sr.

    "It's much easier to quote, than to know." - Ron Chapél


    www.MSUACF.com

  16. The Following User Says Thank You to Doc For This Useful Post:

    KirkS (2 Weeks Ago)

  17. #30
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    West Michigan
    Posts
    1,920
    Thanks
    1,664
    Thanked 2,828 Times in 1,256 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    You're right. Sifu Chow didn't teach forms, and the rumor comes from Mitose who knew a little of the beginner Okinawan forms, but Mr. Parker never taught them. He, in conjunction with Chinese Masters like Sifu Jimmy Woo, and Sifu Ark Wong developed some basic forms that changed over time.
    Prof. Chow knew forms and could demonstrate them, but I don't know if this was done later for demonstration purposes only. Mitose DID teach the Naihanchi kata, but that is really the only kata known for sure that he taught in the early days. In Ed Parker's first book, he does show a counter to a kick using the "sweep step" from Naihanchi kata (sorry don't have my copy in front of me to give a page reference). But, in regards to the claims of the article. There is no historical or even anecdotal proof that any of the Heian/Pinan katas were ever taught by Mitose. From what we know, Mitose taught very basic Okinawan karate and copied almost all of his first book, "what is self-defense" from a Motobu book on karate.

    Prof. Chow demonstrating a form.
    "For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer."

    Romans 13:4

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to punisher73 For This Useful Post:

    KirkS (2 Weeks Ago)

  19. #31
    Doc's Avatar
    Doc
    Doc is offline
    AKI Contributing Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    8,418
    Thanks
    4,260
    Thanked 14,897 Times in 5,568 Posts

    Default Re: Has anyone Else ready this article?

    Quote Originally Posted by punisher73 View Post
    Prof. Chow knew forms and could demonstrate them, but I don't know if this was done later for demonstration purposes only. Mitose DID teach the Naihanchi kata, but that is really the only kata known for sure that he taught in the early days. In Ed Parker's first book, he does show a counter to a kick using the "sweep step" from Naihanchi kata (sorry don't have my copy in front of me to give a page reference). But, in regards to the claims of the article. There is no historical or even anecdotal proof that any of the Heian/Pinan katas were ever taught by Mitose. From what we know, Mitose taught very basic Okinawan karate and copied almost all of his first book, "what is self-defense" from a Motobu book on karate.

    Prof. Chow demonstrating a form.
    Correct as usual. It was only later after Mr. Parker had achieved a measure of notoriety on the mainland did he begin to wear fancy embroidered uniforms with a huge gold belt and come out to "display" and do demos, most felt out of jealousy. Mr. Parker had made a deal with Sifu Chow to bring him over and set him up with a school when Mr. Parker became successful, but when Mr. Parker tried to fulfill that promise Chow turned him down, Only to later come back and ask for a "piece" of Mr. Parker's success. The more Chinese-like forms he did it was said he knew all along but chose not to teach forms, until he began to collaborate with Sam Kohoa. Sifu Chow also had to have someone speak for him because he couldn't read or write well.
    "Nothing is more dangerous than the conscientiously ignorant, or the sincerely stupid." - Martin Luther King Jr.

    "Knowledge speaks but wisdom listens." - Ed Parker Sr.

    "It's much easier to quote, than to know." - Ron Chapél


    www.MSUACF.com

  20. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Doc For This Useful Post:

    KirkS (2 Weeks Ago),punisher73 (2 Weeks Ago)

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Remove Ads

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Get Ready!
    By BillPiper in forum Events
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-08-2009, 01:51 PM
  2. Replies: 20
    Last Post: 11-13-2008, 03:04 PM
  3. Question about whena student is ready for promotion.
    By jjpregler in forum Kenpo General
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 08-29-2007, 12:02 AM
  4. ackks dvd's and videos are now ready
    By ackks10 in forum Kenpo News
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-08-2005, 01:57 AM

Tags for this Thread