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Thread: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

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    Default Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    Sorry to always be making these threads questioning everything, but I enjoy all the replies and insights that everyone leaves.

    So, stripping evreything down to 55 techniques, is it still Ed Parker Kenpo?

    How did the Kenpo community react to the IKCA when it was first established?

    Thanks

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    Default Re: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    To paraphrase a concurrantly running thread elsewhere: Kenpo, yes. Ed Parker Kenpo, no. More appropriately, "Sullivan" or "LeReaux" Kenpo.

    However, the final answer ultimately depends on how broadly or how narrowly you define Ed Parker's Kenpo.
    Clear mind, clear movement. Mastery of the Arts is mastery over the Self. That in this moment, this motion, the thoughts, memories, impulses and passions that cloud the mind must yield to the clarity of purpose, and purity of motion.

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    Default Re: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    "When I am gone, I hope that people won't try to traditionalize my Art. I want you to always remember that Kenpo will always be the Art of Perpetual Change. If you remember this, then the Art will never become obsolete because it will change with the times. While the ignorant refuse to study and the intelligent never stop, we should always be mindful of the fact that our reward in life is proportionate with the contributions we make. A true Martial Artist is not one who fears change, but one who causes it to happen. To live is to change, and to obtain perfection is to have changed often. Progress is a necessity that is a part of nature. While it is true that casting the old aside is not necessary in order to obtain something new, we should study old theories not as a means of discrediting them, but to see if they can be modified to improve our present conditions. A word of advice, The humble man makes room for progress; the proud man believes he is already there."

    Edmund Kealoha Parker Sr.
    Volume 2, Infinite Insights



    Is Kenpo still Karate ? even though it has went through many changes along they way , and been melted with various styles and systems and thoughts ?

    While im not sure what would be the correct awnser, my opinion is no, it would be a branch, but where there be a branch there is a necessity for roots. I think all Arts and systems will be forever changing to adapt to the times in which we live, and i think it is the way that all great teachers would want it. The greatest thing anyone can teach another, is the ability to think for themselves.

    Whille i wont say, and wouldnt be an authority on it even if i would, as to which is better, there is no better and no worse, the root gives birth to the branches and allows them to grow in any direction they choose, it is up to the climber to select what branches best serve his climb to the top of the tree .
    Last edited by unshackled-chi; 05-19-2007 at 12:37 AM.
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    Default Re: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    Great question.I agree with Dave's statement, with a small change. It most definitely is Kenpo and it is Ed Parker Kenpo in the sense that it is a derivative of what Mr. Parker taught. Is it the 10/24 or even the 32 or 16 technique system? No, decidedly not. Yet it is elements of that art and what preceded it in Parker's development. After all Mr. Sullivan was one of the few that Ed Parker awarded a 7th to, and Mr. LeRoux had a 5th from him. You would have no trouble recognizing that it is Kenpo and visually most folks have no trouble seeing that what Ed Parker taught is deeply imbedded.

    How was it received? Interesting question. Most folks think that the IKCA sprung forth as the video learning system is today. That Mr. Sullivan and Mr. LeRoux threw it together over a couple of weekends just to make some quick bucks. Nothing could be further from the truth. The Karate Connection started as a school, and it was school that Mr. Parker visited on a regular basis. There is video of Mr. Parker teaching and participating in promotions at the Karate Connection school. What many folks don't understand is that the changes to the curriculum that were occuring at the Karate Connection school were done with Mr. Parker's full knowledge and blessing.

    When Mr. Parker passed it was a different story. Plenty of folks came out of the woodwork condemning what Sullivan/LeRoux had done and it continues to this day. The interesting thing is that while Mr. Parker was still alive, these folks kept their mouth shut, at least to Mr. Parker, Chuck Sullivan and Vic LeRoux.

    Take the IKCA and its curriculum for what you will. Is it EPAK, no. Is it based on EPAK with the Kenpo principles and concepts in place, yes.

    Respects,
    Bill Parsons
    Triangle Kenpo Institute
    www.trianglekenpo.com

    "I know Kenpo!" "Cool... do you know how to use it?"

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    Default Re: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    For your reference:
    What is the IKCA?

    It depends on how you define "Parker Kenpo." I've studied both. The principles taught are the same, even some of the techniques are the same or very similar (imagine that!...same principles are being taught)

    IMHO, the real difference is in the methodology and approach to teaching. What drew me to their curriculum was that it was not bogged down in redundancies and, IMHO, got right to the "meat of the matter." Basics are the primary focus and I like that because they are the foundation on which all else is built.


    "If one's definition of the whole system includes the entirety of all the moves and sets and forms and techniques and all their extensions dating back to Year One, then today I neither teach nor practice the whole system of Ed Parker's American Kenpo. Alternatively, what I do teach through the Karate Connection is the whole system of Ed Parker's American Kenpo as defined by its simplistic complete structure that includes all the basic stances, strikes and footwork, as well as the principles and concepts." -Vic LeRoux excerpt from "The Journey"
    "It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence." – Charles A. Beard

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    Default Re: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    Thanks everyone for your answers, I appreciate them!

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    Default Re: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    Quote Originally Posted by bdparsons View Post
    Great question.I agree with Dave's statement, with a small change. It most definitely is Kenpo and it is Ed Parker Kenpo in the sense that it is a derivative of what Mr. Parker taught. Is it the 10/24 or even the 32 or 16 technique system? No, decidedly not. Yet it is elements of that art and what preceded it in Parker's development. After all Mr. Sullivan was one of the few that Ed Parker awarded a 7th to, and Mr. LeRoux had a 5th from him. You would have no trouble recognizing that it is Kenpo and visually most folks have no trouble seeing that what Ed Parker taught is deeply imbedded.

    How was it received? Interesting question. Most folks think that the IKCA sprung forth as the video learning system is today. That Mr. Sullivan and Mr. LeRoux threw it together over a couple of weekends just to make some quick bucks. Nothing could be further from the truth. The Karate Connection started as a school, and it was school that Mr. Parker visited on a regular basis. There is video of Mr. Parker teaching and participating in promotions at the Karate Connection school. What many folks don't understand is that the changes to the curriculum that were occuring at the Karate Connection school were done with Mr. Parker's full knowledge and blessing.

    When Mr. Parker passed it was a different story. Plenty of folks came out of the woodwork condemning what Sullivan/LeRoux had done and it continues to this day. The interesting thing is that while Mr. Parker was still alive, these folks kept their mouth shut, at least to Mr. Parker, Chuck Sullivan and Vic LeRoux.

    Take the IKCA and its curriculum for what you will. Is it EPAK, no. Is it based on EPAK with the Kenpo principles and concepts in place, yes.

    Respects,
    Bill Parsons
    Triangle Kenpo Institute
    You beat me to it sir. The Karate Connection was indeed born while Ed Parker was alive. We visited often to the 137th and Hawthorne studio, in Hawthorne California in the late seventies into the eighties.

    The video componant came much later, but the association, patch, and structure existed well prior to Mr. Parker's death. Mr. Parker had absolutely no problem with it. This was typical of Ed Parker who NEVER told his students HOW to interpret their lessons with him.

    My opinion is, it the interpretation of the lessons of the founders, as they choose to present it. Those who may disagree may argue priciples or concepts of execution as all do, but its origin is Ed Parker whatever anyone chooses to call it.
    "Nothing is more dangerous than the conscientiously ignorant, or the sincerely stupid." - Martin Luther King Jr.

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    Default Re: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc View Post
    You beat me to it sir. The Karate Connection was indeed born while Ed Parker was alive. We visited often to the 137th and Hawthorne studio, in Hawthorne California in the late seventies into the eighties.

    The video componant came much later, but the association, patch, and structure existed well prior to Mr. Parker's death. Mr. Parker had absolutely no problem with it. This was typical of Ed Parker who NEVER told his students HOW to interpret their lessons with him.

    My opinion is, it the interpretation of the lessons of the founders, as they choose to present it. Those who may disagree may argue priciples or concepts of execution as all do, but its origin is Ed Parker whatever anyone chooses to call it.
    Thank you sir.

    Respects,
    Bill Parsons
    Triangle Kenpo Institute
    www.trianglekenpo.com

    "I know Kenpo!" "Cool... do you know how to use it?"

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    Default Re: Is it still "Ed Parker Kenpo" ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Celtic_Crippler View Post

    IMHO, the real difference is in the methodology and approach to teaching. What drew me to their curriculum was that it was not bogged down in redundancies and, IMHO, got right to the "meat of the matter." Basics are the primary focus and I like that because they are the foundation on which all else is built.
    I couldn't agree with you more. When you break down any form of Kenpo it comes right down the the basics....the ABC's. Problem is sometimes too many people are learning to speak before learning how to speak. The feeling I got with the IKCA is they really want you to fully understand the why's before the how's.

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